HomeMy WebLinkAbout2025-07-09 Planning & Transportation Commission Verbatim Minutes_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Planning & Transportation Commission 1
Verbatim Minutes: July 9, 2025 2
Council Chambers & Virtual 3
6:00 PM 4
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Call to Order / Roll Call 6
6:00 pm 7
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Chair Akin: Good evening and welcome back, everyone. I call to order this July 9, 2025, regular 9
meeting of the Planning and Transportation Commission. Welcome also to Mr. Tavera, who's 10
helping us out tonight. Would you please call the roll? 11
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Roll Call 13
Administrative Associate Samuel Tavera: Chair Akin? 14
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Chair Akin: Here. 16
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Samuel Tavera: Vice Chair Chang? 18
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Vice Chair Chang: Here. 20
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Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Hechtman? 22
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
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Commissioner Hechtman: Here. 2
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Samuel Tavera: Commissioner James? 4
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Commissioner James: Here. 6
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Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Ji? 8
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Commissioner Ji: Here. 10
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Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Peterson? 12
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Commissioner Peterson: Here. 14
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Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Templeton? 16
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Commissioner Templeton: Here. 18
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Samuel Tavera: We have a quorum. 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Chair Akin: Thank you. 2
3
Oral Communications 4
The public may speak to any item not on the agenda. Three (3) minutes per speaker.1,2 5
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Chair Akin: Do we have any public comments for items that are not on the agenda? 7
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Samuel Tavera: Through the Chair, we ha-, I have not received any further comment cards or 9
online. 10
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Chair Akin: Very good. Thank you. 12
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Agenda Changes, Additions and Deletions 14
The Chair or Commission majority may modify the agenda order to improve meeting management. 15
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Chair Akin: Assistant Director Armer, do we have any request for agenda changes? 17
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Assistant Director Jennifer Armer: No agenda changes. 19
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Chair Akin: All right. 21
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
City Official Reports 2
3
1. Directors Report, Meeting Schedule and Assignments 4
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Chair Akin: Shall we start with you for reports? 6
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Jennifer Armer: Yes. Thank you. So I did wanna start by introducing Sam Tavera, who is joining 8
us from the Clerk's Department. He will be supporting the Planning and Transportation 9
Commission as well as our other boards for the next few months, and so you've seen some 10
correspondence from him but you can reach out to him similar as you did to Veronica in the 11
past if you have any questions, issues, or need support. So then I will move on to the next page 12
here, the Director's Report, to just give you an update on upcoming items for the Planning and 13
Transportation Commission. We'll go to the next slide. There we go. 14
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So July 30th is your next meeting. We have scheduled the next review of the draft Stream 16
Protection Ordinance and we have a request for a hearing on a Conditional Use Permit at 400 17
Mitchell Lane and the following meeting will be August 13th. However, at this time, we do not 18
have any agenda items, and so that agenda is not yet set. Also wanted to remind you all, any 19
who haven't yet done it, that the City does require you to do the anti-harassment training. That 20
is required to be completed by the end of this month. Next slide. 21
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
And so then Council updates. We had a couple of meetings in June that included items that 1
were reviewed by the Planning and Transportation Commission. The Safe Streets for All Plan 2
was approved on June 2nd and there was an urgency ordinance in accordance with Senate Bill 3
1123 that was approved on June 9th by City Council. And a reminder that City Council is on 4
break through the end of this month. 5
6
That concludes my report. I will then now pass off to our new Chief Transportation Official, who 7
is here to introduce herself to you, Ria Lo. 8
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Chief Transportation Official Ria Lo: Hello. I'm Ria Hutabarat Lo, new transportation – Chief 10
Transportation Official. I'm really excited to be here. I'm looking forward to bringing a few 11
transportation-related items and getting to know you more. And also, I have some updates on 12
transportation. Do you want them now? Okay. 13
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So we have a couple of updates. So as was mentioned already, the Safety Action Plan has been 15
adopted on – at the beginning of June. Also, El Camino Real, you might've noticed that a lot of 16
the work has been done. So the paving has all been completed. The striping is 95% complete. 17
There's just a little bit more to go by the end of, I think, August. The quick curbs, which is those 18
vertical delineators between the bicycle facility and the travel lanes for vehicles, those I thi-, I'm 19
not sure what percentage complete but they should be completed within the next couple of 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
weeks. Caltrans has said the 18th of July for that – for the completion of that. And then the no 1
parking signage. Some of that has been done. Actually, most of it has been done but they 2
expect to complete the rest of them by the end of August, and so they could potentially start 3
enforcing after that. And then electrical signal detection will be done by December, so the 4
signals are not really working the way that they should be yet but that will happens towards the 5
end of the year. 6
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Chair Akin: Do we have any questions for Ms. Armer or Ms. Lo? Commissioner Templeton, I 8
have a light on for you. Is that – Vice Chair Chang. 9
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Vice Chair Chang: Hi. Welcome. I have a question that may not be related to El Camino per se 11
but maybe it is. The intersection at Page Mill and El Camino was having a lot of problems maybe 12
more last month. I don't know. I wasn't driving it as much this month. But do you know what 13
the cause of that was? Was it related to the Caltrans work or... 14
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Ria Lo: Was it Page Mill or was it University? 16
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Vice Chair Chang: Page Mill. 18
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Ria Lo: Oh, okay. I can look into that and find out. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
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Vice Chair Chang: Okay. I'm just curious because it was – and every time it happens, obviously it 2
causes a massive backup but... 3
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Ria Lo: Okay. 5
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Vice Chair Chang: ...yeah. 7
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Ria Lo: Yeah. 9
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Vice Chair Chang: Thanks. 11
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Chair Akin: Commissioner Ji. 13
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Commissioner Ji: Thank you, Chair. I had a quick question for Assistant Director Armer on the 15
slide. I think you referenced an urgent ordinance that was passed by the City Council. Can you 16
just elaborate a little bit more on what that bill was about? 17
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Jennifer Armer: Sure. I can give a brief summary and then I – also, this full staff report that was 19
presented to the Council for consideration has additional background. Senate Bill 1123 was a 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
senate bill that actually went into effect on July 1st of this year and it is a – just at a high level, 1
similar to SB9 that allows for a subdivision of up to 10 lots. There are certain criteria but keeps 2
it as a ministerial process, meaning no discretion. But there was an opportunity for local 3
governments to set a process and certain types of regulation. One of the key things was to 4
choose whether those new lots would be allowed to have accessory dwelling units allowed on 5
them or not. And so this was an item to have Council provide direction as a temporary urgency 6
ordinance. It is the sort of thing that then we will need to bring to Planning Commission for a 7
recommendation on a permanent ordinance to implement that as a permanent part of the 8
code. Thank you. 9
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Commissioner Ji: Thank you. 11
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Chair Akin: Any other questions? Commissioner Hechtman. 13
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Commissioner Hechtman: Just a question on – and welcome. A question on the progress on El 15
Camino. Have you heard the status of the extensions of these bike lanes that are now on El 16
Camino through Palo Alto down through Mountain View and up through Menlo Park? Are they 17
in a similar condition of near completion? 18
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Ria Lo: I believe so. I think that the – I think that they may be further along in Mountain View 1
just from what I've seen because I – they started at that end with the delineators, so yeah. But 2
similar level and that – the electrical I think is at the same time as well. 3
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Commissioner Hechtman: All right. Thank you. 5
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Ria Lo: Same schedule. 7
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Chair Akin: Any other questions? 9
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Study Session 11
Public Comment is Permitted. Three (3) minutes per speaker. 12
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2. Study Session on Conceptual Site Layouts and Circulation for the Cubberley Master 14
Plan at 4000 Middlefield Road. CEQA Status: The Master Plan will undergo CEQA 15
review. 16
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Chair Akin: All right. If no, I believe it's time to move on to our first item. So may we have the 18
staff presentation? 19
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Assistant Director of Community Services Amanda Deml: All right. All right. Good evening, Chair 21
Akin and Vice Chair Chang and Commissioners. My name is Amanda Deml and I am joined this 22
evening by park – excuse me – Community Services Director Kristen O’Kane. We're also joined 23
virtually by our master planning consultants Concordia virtually from New Orleans, Steven 24
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Bingler and Elizabeth Chen, who will introduce themselves fully as they present in the coming 1
slides. We are here this evening to host a study session and share with you an update on our 2
project and the three conceptual site layouts and circulation plans for the Cubberley master 3
plan located at 4000 Middlefield Road. Next slide, please. 4
5
Before we share with you the conceptual plans, we want to provide you a brief background on 6
the project, since this is our first meeting with you on this project. A comprehensive 7
background summary of actions to date is Attachment A in your packets but we will briefly 8
cover a few key highlights now. The Cubberley site is a total of 35 acres. The City currently owns 9
eight acres and leases much of the remaining 27 acres from PAUSD, which is the Palo Alto 10
Unified School District. In October of 2024, PAUSD and the City Council approved an MOU 11
Memorandum of Understanding outlining future conditions, which included a land purchase of 12
seven additional acres by the City. This is contingent on a successful bond measure by voters in 13
November of 2026. In December 2024, the City initiated a new master planning process 14
building upon the previous 2019 Master Plan. Next slide, please. 15
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Concordia is leading the master planning process once again, which is a great benefit as they 17
led the 2019 effort, so they have extensive knowledge of the Cubberley site, our community, 18
and have established relationships with our staff. The City has also contracted with FM3 to lead 19
polling efforts and Lew Edwards Group to lead our ballot strategy. City Council also established 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
an ad hoc committee to review and advise staff on efforts related to polling and development 1
of a ballot measure, including polling, financial and revenue forecasting, master planning, and 2
community outreach. Next slide, please. 3
4
A great deal of work has been completed to date on the work plan. Some of the milestones are 5
listed here. February 18th, the City Council hosted their visioning session for the Cubberley site. 6
March 19th, we held our first Master Planning Community Meeting. April 21st, the City Council 7
gave direction on Poll Number 1, which was then released on April 28th and then reviewed the 8
results with the City Council on June 9th. Recently on June 12th, we held our second 9
community meeting for the master planning process. June 19th, we went to the Public Art 10
Commission and recently, on June 24th, the Parks and Recreation Commission. The next set of 11
milestones coming up just through September – otherwise, this would be a very long list – is we 12
are meeting with you all here tonight at the Planning and Transportation Commission. We will 13
be visiting the Architectural Review Board next week on July 17th. We will be going to City 14
Council on August 18th. September 17th, we will hold our third and final community meeting, 15
and September 23rd, back to the Parks and Recreation Commission. Next slide, please. 16
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In your packets, you will find a full summary of community Meetings 1 and 2, describing in 18
more detail the meeting activities as well as a broader summary of the results. What we'd like 19
to highlight briefly on this slide are the key themes and priorities that we heard in Meeting 1, to 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
have those be top-of-mind as we frame the conversation tonight, to share those guiding 1
principles in Concordia's designs that they're about to present to you. The key themes were 2
flexibility, inclusivity, sustainability, and affordability. The top priorities that the community 3
shared and are wanting are multi-purpose spaces, wellness access, green space, and 4
community gathering areas. For Meeting 2, which was recently held on June 12th, over 130 5
community members attended and reviewed the three concept designs and gave feedback 6
through group activities and individual ratings on layout, access, and site experience. The full 7
summary report for Meeting 2 will be published soon. The preliminary findings show a strong 8
preference for partially underground parking and concerns about the above-ground structure, 9
general preference for new construction and some support for partial renovation if it results in 10
significant cost savings, emphasis on separating bike and pedestrian paths for safety, and 11
appreciated the direct bike connection from Nelson to Middlefield, strong support for public 12
gathering spaces that encourage community interaction and appreciated the large, flexible 13
open spaces. The overall rankings were Concept 1, the Diagonal, scored the highest across the 14
six evaluation categories and Concept 3, the Linear, was a close second. Next slide, please. 15
16
Now I will turn it over to Elizabeth and Steven from Concordia to introduce themselves and 17
share with you the three conceptual designs for the site. Elizabeth? 18
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_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Elizabeth Chen: Good evening and thank you so much for having us and for this opportunity to 1
get y'all's feedback on the – on improving Cubberley. My name is Elizabeth Chen. I'm an 2
architect at Concordia and I'm the project manager for this Cubberley project. Steven? 3
4
Steven Bingler: I'm Steven Bingler. I'm the founder and CEO of Concordia. I'm delighted to be 5
here with you guys again. We enjoyed the first round of this and we're very excited about 6
drilling down to this implementation phase and Elizabeth's gonna walk you through the 7
presentation and then we're gonna be available for questions and answers after that. 8
9
Elizabeth Chen: Okay. Yeah. Thank you, Steven. Okay. So we are gonna go over the three 10
concept designs that we presented at the community meeting last month. One thing to note is 11
that the existing site features – well, if you basically broke out the square footages of the 12
existing site, you would get that bar graph that's – the top bar graph. And then if you took the 13
proposed designs, all three concept designs that we are proposing increase the number of 14
square footage for outdoor space as well as indoor space as well as parking. So again, just 15
important to note that all three schemes have roughly the same amount of outdoor, indoor, 16
and parking square footage. Okay. Next slide, please. Okay. 17
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So the three concept designs that we'll be showing to you are the Diagonal Concept Design, the 19
Grid Concept Design, and the Linear Concept Design. Of note, the Diagonal did receive the most 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
cumulative positive responses, so I'll be spending a little bit more time on that scheme but I'll 1
also point out some of the features that resonated or didn't resonate with the Grid and Linear 2
schemes. For each concept design, I'll talk about building layouts and massing, which includes 3
setbacks and height. We'll also talk about outdoor space in relation to the promenades and also 4
pedestrian and bike circulation. And then for each concept design, there are shown three 5
different options, so there's sub-options for each concept design. The first option is for all new 6
construction. That means demoing the existing buildings and building all new. The second 7
option shows renovation of three of the buildings, which I'll show you in the next slide. And 8
then the third option shows structured parking, which is basically a multi-story parking garage. 9
10
And on the next slide, you can see those options sort of diagramed out. Okay. So as a bit of a 11
graphic legend, that – the left image under New Construction shows – anything shown in white 12
on the concept designs indicates a new construction building. There's two basic types of new 13
buildings. You can see that larger square building at the top. That denotes the Recreation and 14
Wellness Center, which includes four hard courts as well as associated spaces. And then the 15
other building type is that more linear building type. This is shown as a 70-foot-wide bay that 16
can take the form of different configurations. The reason why we're showing that 70-foot bay is 17
because it's a convenience dimension for flexible uses. Everything that is in Cubberley right now 18
besides the courts, like the basketball courts, can fit in that 70-foot-wide bay, whether that's 19
classrooms, even a theater, parking, multi-use space, flexible rental space, et cetera. Those can 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
all sort of get chopped up into that 70-foot-wide bay, so that's why you'll see that 70-foot-wide 1
sort of [snake 34:37] in a lot of the schemes. Okay. 2
3
Under Partial Renovation, you'll see that sandy-colored building, so anywhere you see that 4
sand-colored building, that denotes partial renovation. The three buildings that we are 5
proposing that could be partially renovated or renovated are the pavilion, the theater, and then 6
Building I, which is the only 2-story building, which is in the center of campus. That's the one 7
that's turned at a big of an angle. When we say "renovation" what we mean is a full gut down 8
to the structural elements. These three buildings are concrete frame and tilt-up panel that 9
includes full code updates such as seismic, accessibility, sustainability, with all new utilities and 10
MEP systems. And then to note, these first two options, New Construction and Partial 11
Renovation, they show – they include a partially underground parking, which is denoted by that 12
dotted line in both of those images. And then for the third option, that shows structured 13
parking, so anywhere where you see that dark gray block building, that will denote a structured 14
parking, which is a 4-story parking garage and then that circle denotes a speed ramp to get up 15
to it. Of note is that we're proposing something that Palo Alto is already d-, already proposing, 16
which is a flat-floored parking garage. That means that in the future, if there's less need for car 17
use and parking, that parking garage can get turned into program use, either all at once or floor 18
by floor, depending on the demand for parking at that time. Okay. 19
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_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
So now we can get on to the concept designs. So that next slide – thank you. The next slide 1
shows the Concept 1, the Diagonal Scheme, and again, this is the one that received the most 2
positive cumulative responses from the community meeting. The main design move for the 3
Diagonal Scheme is that connection of the bike route from Nelson Drive, shown off the top of 4
the page, cutting through the campus at that diagonal and connecting that bike and pedestrian 5
route to the bike and pedestrian route that's along Middlefield. The buildings also reinforce 6
that design move, celebrating that bike and pedestrian connection and making it a real design 7
feature and the – as the buildings flank that promenade and really highlight it, they also start to 8
form courtyards or outdoor spaces in between the buildings, which is something that 9
community members also responded well to. They liked the openness and scale of those open 10
spaces between the buildings. 11
12
Of note, the vehicular access in all of the concept designs is similar. We're proposing to keep 13
the access points on either side of the site, so on the left and the right side of the site in this 14
image. And then off of those existing vehicular access points, you can see these horseshoe-15
shaped figures, which denote mobility hubs. That can mean things like an Uber or car drop-off 16
but it's also meant to be multi-modal, supporting many modes of transportation, such as 17
transit, bikes, pedestrians, rideshares, et cetera. One note is that Greendell School is shown off 18
to the left in all of the schemes. That's existing to remain. Okay. 19
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_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
On the next slide, you'll see a three-dimensional view of that scheme, so you can see – in all of 1
the schemes, actually, we're proposing a massing strategy that keeps the lower buildings, the 1-2
story buildings towards Middlefield to mimic the scale of the single-story residential buildings 3
across Middlefield and then towards the back of the site, we're proposing more of the 2-story 4
buildings. That gym building, the more square building that you see on the right side, that 5
obviously has higher ceilings for a basketball court and what you're seeing here is two 6
basketball courts shown on the first floor, two basketball courts shown on the fourth – on the 7
second floor. You will also see here the protected trees on campus. By no means are these the 8
only trees that are gonna be on the plan but these are definitely the trees that we know exactly 9
where they are and that they're definitely staying but you can expect to see more trees and 10
landscaping as well. 11
12
And then one last thing that I'll note here is the setbacks and height limitations. So all of our 13
designs – our concept designs show complying with the setbacks on all sides and complying 14
with the height limitations and not only are we complying with them but we're buffering them. 15
They're set back more than what's required. The closest it comes is – if you see the – on the 16
right side, that – the corner of that building is about 45 feet away from the setback. It's a lot 17
more than what the ordinance requires but – okay. 18
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_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
So the next slide shows that second option for renovations, so again, you'll see that same 1
Diagonal Scheme, that concept design but with that second option for renovation. Again, the 2
tan buildings denote a renovated building. That's the theater, the pavilion, and Building I. And 3
on the next slide, you'll see the third option for the structured parking, so that darker gray mass 4
shown on the upper center left of the image is that structured parking. Again, it's four stories 5
and again, it's still meeting the setback and height requirements per the zoning ordinance. 6
7
Okay. So on the next slide, we'll start with the second concept design, the Grid Scheme. And the 8
main design move for the Grid Scheme is this network of orthogonally crossing bike and 9
pedestrian promenades. So again, it does definitely connect the Nelson bike and pedestrian 10
routes to the Middlefield bike and pedestrian routes, this time at an orthogonal relationship. 11
The outdoor spaces – there's more of the outdoor spaces but they're slightly smaller. Just a 12
reminder that all of the concept designs have roughly the same square footage of open space 13
and buildings. This one features the same square footage, just m-, distributed amongst more 14
but smaller open spaces. Okay. 15
16
And then the next slide, you'll see that in the 3-dimensional view. Again, the first option is for 17
new construction. Again, with a similar massing scheme with the 1-story buildings along 18
Middlefield, the 2-story buildings along the back of the site, and also the vehicular access is 19
similar as well with those mobility hubs coming off of the existing vehicle access points. Okay. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
And then the next slide shows the second option for the Grid Scheme with the renovation of 1
the pavilion, the theater, and Building I. And then the next slide shows that third option for the 2
structured parking in a similar location, again, still meeting the setback and height 3
requirements. Okay. 4
5
So Concept 3 on the next slide is the Linear Scheme and the main design feature of this one 6
celebrates a central outdoor amenity space. It's that area sort of in a rectangular arrangement 7
of orange promenade lines, so that area is an outdoor space that is for bike and pedestrian 8
flow. It's also for community gathering, which was a very – which was an idea that resonated 9
with a lot of community members and it's an inviting gesture for people both within the 10
campus as well as for people coming off of Middlefield. Okay. The next slide shows the new 11
construction 3D view. Again, the 1-story buildings facing Middlefield, the 2-story buildings 12
towards the back of the site. All of the protected trees are in this plan. The next slide shows 13
that second option again, with the renovated theater, pavilion, and Building I. And then the 14
next slide again shows that third option for the structured parking, that 4-story building in gray. 15
Okay. 16
17
The next slide is just a summary of all of the concept designs that we just presented to you. 18
After analyzing the comments from the community meetings, we have come up with a design 19
direction to proceed generally with the diagonal layout, which people resonated with, and 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
incorporating features of that central community gathering inviting open space, similar to the 1
Linear Scheme, and also incorporating efficient flow of paths that was from the Grid Layout. 2
We're gonna be also developing these details and getting more into the nitty gritty in 3
conjunction with our consultants who are transportation engineers, our structural engineer, 4
cost estimator, and our sustainability consultant, so you can look forward to an update at the 5
ARB later this month. All right. Thank you and I'll turn it back over to Amanda. Thank you so 6
much. 7
8
Amanda Deml: Okay. Next slide, please. All right. Thank you, Elizabeth. The next steps in the 9
master planning process include collecting and analyzing the feedback received here tonight, 10
along with the input gathered at the June 12th community meeting, the June 24th PRC 11
Meeting, and staff at Concordia will present the concept designs next to the Architectural 12
Review Board as mentioned earlier tonight, next week on July 17th. Following the summer 13
meetings, several key milestones remain. At the third and final community meeting on 14
September 17th, Concordia will present one refined concept plan for additional public input. 15
This will ultimately lead to their final presentation to the community and City Council on 16
December 8th, which will include the proposed master plan, a cost estimate, and phasing 17
scenarios. Next slide, please. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
All right. So we have shared a lot of information with you tonight, so to recap what staff are 1
requesting from the Commission this evening, we would love your feedback on the three 2
Cubberley conceptual designs, including the same aspects the community evaluated, such as 3
the arrival and parking, pedestrian circulation, building scale and physical space organization, 4
landscape and green space organization, the balance of buildings and green space, being a good 5
neighbor to the surrounding neighborhoods and local business. Also, any additional comments 6
or general feedback that can help inform the refinement of the preferred concept are 7
encouraged and appreciated. Next slide, please. 8
9
All right. That concludes our presentation. Thank you so much for your time and your attention. 10
We now invite your comments, your feedback, discussion. Director O'Kane and I as well as 11
Concordia, Elizabeth and Steven, are available to answer your questions. I'm gonna please ask 12
Mr. Tavera to go back to the previous slide, so we'll just keep our questions up and yeah. We 13
welcome your feedback. Thank you. 14
15
Chair Akin: Thank you very much. That's a great deal of information to absorb but I think we're 16
ready for it. Clarifying questions, beginning with Commissioner Templeton. 17
18
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: Hi. Thank you. I really appreciated that. I was wondering if you can 1
tell me a little bit more about the underground parking along Middlefield. You said it was gonna 2
be multiple stories deep. Can you tell me... 3
4
Elizabeth Chen: [Inaudible 49:09]. 5
6
Commissioner Templeton: ...how many... 7
8
Female: Yes. Go ahead, Elizabeth or Steven. 9
10
Steven Bingler: Go ahead, Elizabeth. 11
12
Elizabeth Chen: Oh, okay. I just wanted to clarify – sorry if I miscommunicated earlier. The 13
under – the partially underground parking shown flanking Middlefield is just shown as one 14
level, so that would just be one floor. The multi-story parking structure is a separate option and 15
that's the one in the third option on each concept design that was shown in the darker gray 16
building and that would be a 4-story parking structure. 17
18
Commissioner Templeton: But it's above ground. 19
20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Elizabeth Chen: That's correct. 1
2
Commissioner Templeton: Okay. Good. Yeah. I was looking at the elevation at the site on 3
Middlefield and I was like, "It's 17 feet," so are you at all concerned about the sea level at all 4
with the partially underground parking garage? 5
6
Elizabeth Chen: Yeah. So I think f-, the feedback that we have received is that it's feasible and I 7
know that there is some pushback against fully underground parking but the fact that this is 8
partially underground alleviates a lot of those concerns with the waterproofing. And that it 9
would be – that would be verified with something like a geotechnical report or something like 10
[inaudible 50:51]. 11
12
Commissioner Templeton: And... 13
14
Steven Bingler: I think maybe if I could interject here, what we're describing here is a parking 15
level that's half underground and half above ground. That solves a lot of problems. Number 16
one, it's less expensive than going fully underground but it also provides air and air circulation. 17
For the half of the building that's above ground, the walls would be open, so the air could 18
circulate, which eliminates that sort of dark, dank environment that you usually get with 19
underground parking. It also allows us the ability to actually occupy the space above the 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
parking. We can either – we – it gives us an opportunity in the landscaping to actually mound 1
up and either cover that parking roof with either earth or with public amenities, so we're 2
actually – especially when we think about the value of land per square foot in Palo Alto, there's 3
a lot to be said for taking advantage of being able to use every single square foot of the 4
property that we can possibly muster for public use. And we're still studying the relationship 5
between the structured parking, the 4-story structured parking versus this half underground 6
idea for the 1-story parking but those are the two options that we're looking at at the moment. 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: I appreciate that. And yeah, you're definitely preaching to the choir 9
about the value of land and land use with this particular commission, so we're in complete 10
alignment on that. Are you from New Orleans, by the way? 11
12
Steven Bingler: Yes. Well, I'm... 13
14
Commissioner Templeton: So – from enough. Okay. Well, you may understand what I'm about 15
to say through that lens. This particular part of town is prone to flooding. 16
17
Steven Bingler: Yeah. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: It's closer to the bay than other parts that are hillier and higher 1
elevation, so we just wanna make sure that – the bottom line is – what I'm clarifying is that we 2
wanna make sure that the designs that you're proposing are feasible and that has been 3
considered. So it sounds like designs will be proofed before some... 4
5
Steven Bingler: Yeah. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: ...point when it goes to Council by some engineering people. 8
9
Steven Bingler: Yes, for sure. Stormwater management is very much high on our list. 10
11
Commissioner Templeton: Excellent. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. 12
13
Steven Bingler: [Inaudible 53:30]. 14
15
Chair Akin: Thank you, Commissioner. Vice Chair Chang. 16
17
Vice Chair Chang: Before we give feedback, I wanted to ask some questions because I'm not 18
sure I understood the designs fully with respect to the promenades, so what is the – I 19
understand what some of the use cases could be for really large open spaces or the smaller 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
open spaces but then what about – I'm trying to think what the promenades could be used for 1
and I thought it would be really helpful if you guys could just give some examples of how other 2
communities use this or how other spaces with large, wide promenades in Option 2 and 3 use 3
that type of s-, outdoor space. 4
5
Steven Bingler: I'll jump in and tell you that it's like a p-, it's a pedestrian mall in a way and there 6
are a lot – a lot of the functions that are taking place on the site are functions that invite the 7
opportunity for public access. And what we're proposing is that the space – in that particular 8
case, the space between the buildings would be – in this case, in the case of the Diagonal, now 9
we're looking – we started off with 70-foot clearance and now we're looking at 100-foot 10
clearance. Within that clearance, there are – there's a pedestrian way, a s-, basically a sidewalk 11
that goes adjacent to each one of the buildings to either side and in addition to that, there's a 12
bicycle and pedestrian way – a bicycle path, actually – and then also green space in the middle 13
that would be for children's playgrounds and other things that would happen in that linear 14
space. We have very large courtyards that can also accommodate things – everything that – we 15
haven't drilled down yet but everything you can imagine like amphitheaters and children's 16
playgrounds and even large groves of trees. We can actually imagine some small urban forests 17
in these large, open spaces. So we're trying to create a variety of these public open spaces, ra-, 18
not – rather than having one big open space, we have, in this case, two large courtyards and we 19
call them courtyards but they're really almost like urban forests. And then this linear 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
promenade is one that kind of celebrates the bicycle circulation and pedestrian circulation that 1
goes diagonally through the site. 2
3
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. I think my questions were less about the Diagonal one where the 4
promenade is much more narrow and say Option 3 where it's really wide, so I was like, "What 5
goes down there? A farmer's market?" or what – how would that space be used? And it's 6
interesting to think about playgrounds and stuff. 7
8
Steven Bingler: I will tell you that w-, the way we approached this project is that we presented 9
all three options. We didn't ask the community, "Which is – which one do you choose? Which 10
one would you vote for?" We asked them, "What do you like the most about each one of 11
these?" And they liked the Diagonal in terms of geometry but they also liked, as Elizabeth 12
noted, on the Linear Scheme, they liked the broader promenade, so now we're gonna go back 13
and do a hybrid scheme that has the diagonal geometry but a much wider promenade, which 14
will become more of a public open space... 15
16
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. 17
18
Steven Bingler: ...a linear open public space. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Vice Chair Chang: The second question is about – it's just a clarification to make sure that I 1
understood correctly. So the 70-foot-wide building, that's wide enough to accommodate a 2
theater, like the existing... 3
4
Steven Bingler: Yes. 5
6
Vice Chair Chang: ...theater if we're not rebuild – okay. So great. 7
8
Steven Bingler: But it's also wide enough to have a corridor in the middle with double-loaded 9
spaces on either side or it can be a large space that would be a large gathering space, so it's a 10
very flexible – we're trying to – flexibility is really at the core of this design because over the 11
next 50 years, 100 years, the lifespan of this project, those spaces could accommodate any 12
number of different things, so our idea is that we're trying to develop a – at least in the master 13
planning phase, we're trying to develop a concept that can be – that can provide the most 14
flexibility for the most variety of different uses that could take place in those spaces. 15
16
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. My final question is kind of around Concept 1. There's that big triangle 17
of space that fronts Middlefield. What was the thinking behind that space? 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Steven Bingler: That's gonna be a grand entrance and as we move further into it, it's – we had a 1
great meeting this morning with our transportation consultants and it appears that that might 2
very well actually be an interaction with transit, so the pedestrian and bicycle and transit could 3
easily take place at that location. But you can imagine that's kind of like the grand entrance into 4
the project. 5
6
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. Thank you. That's it for now. 7
8
Chair Akin: Commissioner Hechtman. 9
10
Commissioner Hechtman: Thank you. First question is for staff. So this project is reliant on a 11
bond measure that's anticipated to go to the voters in November of next year. I'm curious 12
through the various meetings, both with members of the public and with various bodies of the 13
City, can you tell me what, if any, discussions have been had about the possibility of private 14
funding of all or any part of this through – and I'm thinking of philanthropic activities. 15
16
Director of Community Services Kristen O’Kane: Good evening. I'm Kristen O'Kane with 17
Community Services. So we have started those conversations. I'll use an example of the Friends 18
of the Recreation Wellness Center, which is a fairly new friends group. They're a nonprofit in 19
Palo Alto who are interested in raising funds to build – we don't have the plans up but to build a 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
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recreation wellness center, which would include gyms and other wellness spaces, so we're 1
looking at opportunities like that to help with the cost of the project. 2
3
Commissioner Hechtman: All right. And I realize how early we are in this project but you do 4
have a scale now in terms of the amount of square footage, which may be all new. Some of it 5
may be renovated. And so are there sort of gross round numbers of the scale of the cost of this 6
project that are available to us? 7
8
Kristen O’Kane: So we're working on those. We have a cost estimator or Concordia does, based 9
in a local – based in California, not New Orleans, and we're also working with our own internal 10
departments to get those cost estimates both for new construction and renovation and we also 11
need to consider that utility infrastructure system likely needs to be upgraded, so that would be 12
a consideration as well, so we're working on that and anticipate to have that in early fall. 13
14
Commissioner Hechtman: Okay. Thank you. And then a question for Mr. Yang. Governor 15
Newsom has recently signed into state law some limitations on the California Environmental 16
Quality Act. Those primarily address residential projects but I'm wondering if any part of that is 17
offering us some streamlining of the review for this project. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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Assistant City Attorney Albert Yang: So as you noted, those are primarily for residential projects 1
and there are a few narrow exemptions also for commercial projects but I don't believe that 2
this would fall within any of those. 3
4
Commissioner Hechtman: Okay. Thank you. Those are my questions. 5
6
Chair Akin: Commissioner Doctor Peterson. 7
8
Commissioner Peterson: Thank you, Chair. So one of the nice things about this project, which I 9
think your map doesn't fully capture, is that this is an incredibly working class and blue collar 10
area of Palo Alto. It has probably the largest existing affordable housing type complex around 11
this site. And so because of that, I wanna ask some questions about the walkability of this site. I 12
don't see the map really showing how does this tie into the adjacent sites, like even the grand 13
corridor down the middle of the site is great. However, the grand corridor doesn't actually tie 14
into any foot traffic. And so do you have a map where you can show the public transit, regional 15
affordable housing that's just across the street essentially? 16
17
Elizabeth Chen: [Inaudible 1:03:44]. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Steven Bingler: That – I'll respond to that. We don't have that drawing available to you right 1
now but we – what we did is we took the – all of the planning that we did in the previous 2
planning process that tied in all those links and we incorporated that into the plan now, so all of 3
those linkages will be made and we actually extended it one step further and are making a 4
linkage even into the shopping center that's to the north end of the site as well. We're 5
extending the pedestrian link into that as well. So... 6
7
Commissioner Peterson: [Inaudible 1:04:25]. 8
9
Steven Bingler: ...all the pedestrian linkages will be – and we just had our first meeting this 10
morning with our transportation consultant, Fehr & Peers, and that will be high on our agenda 11
to make sure that all of those linkages are there. 12
13
Commissioner Peterson: Thank you. That answers my question. Appreciate it. 14
15
Steven Bingler: Sure. 16
17
Chair Akin: Thank you. Commissioner Ji. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Ji: Thank you, Chair. I have a couple larger-style questions. So I guess I'm trying 1
to understand, at the end of the process, the master plan, is that supposed to be – like i-, can 2
you help me elaborate a little bit more? Is it we have all the buildings already set, like it's 3
actually a concrete plan? Or is there a difference between a master plan and an actual plan that 4
we want from the end of this? 5
6
Kristen O’Kane: Sure. I can take that... 7
8
Male: [Yeah 1:05:12]. 9
10
Kristen O’Kane: ...one. So this is a master plan that will consist of a concept plan, so how the 11
buildings exist on the site, what might go in those buildings, how much outdoor space there is. 12
Once this master plan is done, we will then need to – and we have the funding – we'll need to 13
do actual construction drawings and engineering drawings, so between the concept plan and 14
the engineering drawings, I think we could expect there be some minor changes just to make 15
sure that the fit is actually appropriate. So I don't know, Steven or Elizabeth, if you have 16
anything to add there. 17
18
Steven Bingler: Yeah. I will just say that yeah, that – to build on that, is that master planning is 19
literally, as Kristen noted, we're getting the general layout of the buildings. Then there will be 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
an architect, who will – there – who will be brought on board and to actually design the 1
buildings. And at that level, a whole new design process starts with schematic design on the 2
buildings through design development, construction documents, and then construction – the 3
actual construction will take place. So the master plan is dealing with these larger issues, more 4
of the urban design issues, and then the building issues will be addressed in a separate phase. 5
6
Commissioner Ji: Thank you. Just to kind of elaborate a little bit more on that, is the expectation 7
that let's say the drawings that have been provided in the packet are kind of general locations 8
fro buildings, let's say? And then do we expect those to be significant changes before the 9
engineering implementation or we just say we would ideally like to follow the outcome from 10
when we came up with the master plan? 11
12
Kristen O’Kane: We... 13
14
Steven Bingler: [Inaudible 1:07:03]. 15
16
Kristen O’Kane: ...would definitely – I mean, especially if we're asking voters to approve a ballot 17
measure to fund a concept plan that they helped create and that we told them would be built, I 18
mean, our goal would be to follow that as closely as possible. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Steven Bingler: And I would add one more thing is that because we're going through a fairly – 1
pretty extensive community engagement process, we're also gonna be querying the community 2
about the – even things about architectural style and that information will be passed on to the 3
next phase, when the architect will have information from the community about preferences 4
that they might have for what the buildings look like and what materials they might be made of. 5
6
Commissioner Ji: All right. Thank you. And then I have a – kind of a follow-up question here, 7
which is it seems like a lot of the discussion today is around the building designs. I haven't really 8
heard very much about usage and I know Steven, you had mentioned about flexible usage but I 9
– at least in my mind, the way I think about what I want to build is what do I want to support. 10
And I think it's a little bit hard to wrap my head around the concept of trying to design building 11
shapes before I know what I want to put there, so I was wondering if you could elaborate a little 12
bit more on that. 13
14
Elizabeth Chen: Yeah. I can address that. During meeting – during Community Meeting 1, that 15
meeting was more focused on programming and it used the previous master planning process, 16
back from 2019 as a guide, so there are – there is a list of programs and uses and activities that 17
we have in a list and they do include all of the uses that are at Cubberley now and some more 18
expanded uses, such as more gyms and also fine-tuning some more of the ac-, the 19
programming uses. That programming document will also be part of the master plan document. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Ji: Thank you. My follow-up question there is I think – so this is some feedback 2
I've also gotten from members of the public who attended both of the sessions, is that it's really 3
hard to comment on which layout is beneficial if they don't know actually how much space each 4
of the different activities take. So say a theater takes, I don't know, two – oh. I don't even know 5
the units, right? I don't know, 1,000 square feet, let's say, minimum or 10,000 square feet, 6
right? It's really hard to comment on which design – or like t-, like oh, for example, a diagonal 7
building, maybe you can't actually put a theater in the shape of the building, and so I think it'd 8
be really helpful to be able to provi-, kind of attach these two together, right, and say, "I like the 9
design from this but actually, this removes the possibility for me to" – yep. So I know that's not 10
a clarifying question but I wanted to ask if that will be provided, the square footage. Or if you 11
have any usage... 12
13
Steven Bingler: [Inaudible 1:10:07]. 14
15
Commissioner Ji: ...attachments to any of these. 16
17
Steven Bingler: And we will get to that in the next phase and I can assure you that all uses that 18
are pro-, are currently programmed can fit into the configurations that we've outlined. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Ji: All right. Thank you. And then I had a couple of specific questions regarding 1
some of the diagrams here. So on each of the different diagrams, on all three concepts I 2
believe, you included the mobility hub as part of the green space, so I guess I was wondering is 3
the green space – I guess how big is the mobility hub? Or is this – should you be able to do 4
green space activity there? 5
6
Elizabeth Chen: Yeah. Some of our precedence for mobility hubs, they can vary in scale and a lot 7
of mobility hubs also include event space like outdoor event space where you can set up 8
bollards and control traffic, so how big that is we'll definitely get into the next phase. I can't tell 9
you exactly now but that's part of sort of that design process where we're getting into the 10
specifics and can propose different sizes but to answer your question, I don't think there's a one 11
size fits all. We're showing two mobility hubs. They – one of them could support an outdoor 12
event space or a food truck gathering or something like that and the other one could be more 13
minimal. 14
15
Commissioner Ji: Thank you. And then specific – I wanna kind of piggyback off of Vice Chair 16
Chang's comment about the grand promenade on Concept 3, which you're describing as kind of 17
a s-, it's on packet page 35. And it's kind of the space between the two promenades. Can you 18
give me a sense of how wide that grand promenade, the middle space is gonna look like 19
approximately? I'm just trying to visualize as well what actually could fit there because you had 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
mentioned putting a playground there but it looks very skinny compared to this, so I was just 1
hopping to get a better sense of what that sounds like. 2
3
Steven Bingler: [I'll address that 1:12:13]. The one in the Diagonal Scheme was 70 feet wide. 4
The one in the Linear Scheme was I think – Elizabeth, correct me if I'm wrong about this but 5
more on the neighborhood of 200 feet wide. 6
7
Elizabeth Chen: That's correct. 8
9
Steven Bingler: The one – and the one that we're addressing now would be, on the Diagonal, a 10
promenade that's about a 100-foot-wide promenade. 11
12
Commissioner Ji: Thank you. And then I have one final question, which is you had started the 13
whole conversation by saying that the square footage of the buildings and the square footage 14
of the green space is the same across the three designs. Can you talk a little bit more about how 15
we got there? How did we decide that this is the square footage that we should be having at 16
this time? 17
18
Elizabeth Chen: I think that goes back to the programming document, which is based on a lot of 19
the work that was done in 2019, where we came up with a document based on n-, on 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
programmatic need and community feedback, as well as stakeholder feedback for things like 1
the Recreation and Wellness Center and the theater as well as the tenant feedback about their 2
space needs. That square footage has a little bit of flexibility as we develop into cost estimates 3
and progressing the scheme in conjunction with those cost estimates. 4
5
Commissioner Ji: All right. Thank you. Those are all from me, Chair. 6
7
Chair Akin: Commissioner Hechtman. 8
9
Commissioner Hechtman: I already asked my questions. 10
11
Chair Akin: Thank you. Commissioner James, anything for you? 12
13
Commissioner James: Yes. I – Commissioner Ji covered a lot of my questions and concerns. I 14
think the one that's most concerning to me, which I've tried to get my mind around, is the idea 15
of – well, I guess I find the polygons a little – I hate to say arbitrary but I find them a little 16
abstract and arbitrary. I agree with Commissioner Ji that I wanna – we can argue about whether 17
form follows function or [whether 1:44:43] they should meet in the middle or whatever but I 18
feel like it does feel – I don't know what it's connected to and I find that pretty troubling, to be 19
honest, and I find I guess I’m stumbling over the idea that an architect would come in after this 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
sort of geometry had been set and they would just have to accept that and just design – finish 1
the design. And I'm just wondering if that's – I find that very constraining very early on with 2
very little information in terms of my own comfort level and my own understanding of it and I 3
guess I just want – yeah. That's what I wanna clarify, is if – at that – so let's say we get a concept 4
based on whatever the prevailing consensus view, takes into account all the design 5
considerations that have been studied and researched from 2019 to today and the feedback 6
from – I mean, it is clear that a great deal of effort has gone into getting feedback from the 7
community but I guess I worry about – sometimes the best of intentions can end in a collective 8
averaging, if you understand what I'm saying. And I guess what I want to know is if it gets – the 9
bond measure passes and then there is presumably some sort of competition for the architect 10
firm that's chosen, are they handed this and then they're fairly limited in the scope of what they 11
can do? Or can they have a new concept that can be considered? I guess that's... 12
13
Steven Bingler: I... 14
15
Commissioner James: ...really – that's the... 16
17
Steven Bingler: Yeah. [Inaudible 1:16:50]. 18
19
Commissioner James: ...big question I have. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
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1
Steven Bingler: That's actually the de-, almost the very definition of a master plan is that the 2
reason to do a master plan is to do that high level... 3
4
Commissioner James: Mm-hm. 5
6
Steven Bingler: ...right? We're architects as well, by the way. 7
8
Commissioner James: Yeah. 9
10
Steven Bingler: So is to do that concept phase and to narrow it down and the urban planning 11
issues... 12
13
Commissioner James: Uh-huh. 14
15
Steven Bingler: ...and then the next phase will be architectural issues. I think i-, notwithstanding 16
that diagonals look different than orthogonal buildings, I don't know exactly the percentage but 17
somewhere between 95 and 100 percent of the buildings shown on this d-, on even the 18
Diagonal Scheme are rectangular buildings. I mean, [they do 1:17:37] have knuckles at the end 19
of them but functionally, they're rectangular buildings, so – and I don't see that there are 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
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constraints functionally. Aesthetically, it's – we're nailing down things like pedestrian 1
circulation, things like bicycle circulation. One of the things that the community liked a lot 2
about that Diagonal Scheme is that if you're riding a bicycle, it's a lot more convenient to just 3
have an even flow rather than always stopping and taking 90-degree turns, so – the other thing 4
that they liked about this Scheme Number – the Diagonal Scheme was that it had two very 5
large open spaces rather than a lot of smaller open spaces. Those are urban design decisions. 6
There are lots of decisions left to be made at the architectural level as far as the building design, 7
what it looks like, what the materials are, and those kinds of things, so it's not unusual that one 8
team, more of an urban planning approach, determines these larger s-, urban planning 9
decisions and then the architectural decisions carry on from there. It's a – I think of it more as a 10
collaboration in a way 'cause we've done it both ways. 11
12
Commissioner James: [Inaudible 1:19:08]. 13
14
Steven Bingler: We've been on the receiving side of master plans and we've also developed the 15
master plans, so... 16
17
Commissioner James: So they would basically be pretty much constrained to the geometry of 18
whatever is presented in – on – in December. 19
20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Steven Bingler: Yeah. That's right. Whatever it is. And whether it's orthogonal or whether it's 1
diagonal or whatever it is, these are decisions that are being vetted with the community at 2
large and at this point, hundreds of people who have attended these meetings have made the 3
choice that the Diagonal Scheme seems to be more appealing than the Orthogonal Scheme. 4
5
Commissioner James: Yeah. I'll pause right there. 6
7
Chair Akin: All right. And seeing no other lights, I'll wrap up the clarifying round with what few 8
questions I have left. Thank you for addressing most of the ones I had already. If I've totaled up 9
the numbers correctly, the Diagonal Concept has about 10% less outdoor space than the other 10
concepts. I wondered if that was because that layout causes the building footprints to be used 11
less efficiently. Therefore, some additional outdoor space had to be committed to the buildings. 12
So what can you tell me about that? 13
14
Elizabeth Chen: So I think there might be a little bit of a labeling contention. So I know that 15
we've labeled each outdoor space on approximate acreage but the square footages are 16
approximately the same because the footprints are apar-, approximately the same as well, so if 17
you add up the acreage, it doesn't necessarily add up to the whole pie is I guess what I'm 18
saying. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
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3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Steven Bingler: I think it's fair to say that the square footages are the same in all three schemes. 1
2
Chair Akin: Yeah. I guess the concern I had was is the square footage in the non-rectilinear 3
buildings used as efficiently as in the rectilinear case? 4
5
Steven Bingler: Well, I don't know that there's any m-, as an architect, I don't know that there's 6
a correlation between the shape of the square footage and the use of the square footage that – 7
if the square footage is there and it's laid out properly, then whether it's on a diagonal or 8
whether it's on an orthogonal grid, I think creative architects can use either one of those spaces 9
efficiently. So for all [sense 1:22:15] and purposes, each one of the schemes are identical in 10
terms of the total square footage and of the building square footage and the open square 11
footage. 12
13
Chair Akin: Okay. Thank you. That's what I was trying to get at, was that these are essentially 14
equivalent despite the labeling, which led me to believe it might be otherwise. Earlier, we 15
mentioned separating bicycle and pedestrian paths, so just to get some clarity on that, will all 16
the bike paths also have – be accompanied by pedestrian lanes that are physically separated or 17
are they exclusively bicycle paths? 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Steven Bingler: We haven't gotten down to the level of detail on that but I know on the 1
promenade itself, the primary circulation from Nelson to Middlefield, our plan is to have set – 2
completely separate bicycle paths that are separate from the pedestrian paths and the – I will 3
also say that those – at this stage of the game in our consultation with the City agencies and the 4
need for – to provide access for fire trucks and service vehicles, it's likely that those bicycle 5
circulation paths will be extremely generous. 6
7
Chair Akin: Okay. Just to telegraph, I'll be following up on evaluating some of the layouts in 8
terms of the tendency for creation of desire paths because they looked different in that 9
characteristic to me. That'll be in the next round. 10
11
Steven Bingler: Okay. 12
13
PUBLIC COMMENTS 14
15
Chair Akin: All right. I believe that's all I have, so if there are no more clarifying questions, then 16
it's time for public comment. Mr. Tavera, do we have any hands raised or speaker cards? 17
18
Samuel Tavera: Yes. To the Chair, I have one request to speak online. Actually two requests to 19
speak. Oh, three. Sorry about that. Give me one second. 20
21
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Chair Akin: Commissioner Hechtman, do you have something? I see your light is on. 1
2
Samuel Tavera: All right. Our first speaker is gonna be Sonya B. You can now speak, Sonya. 3
4
Sonya Bradski: Yeah. Hi. My name is Sonya Bradski. I'm actually a next door neighbor to 5
Cubberley for 29 years and I guess for me, I guess just a couple comments. I was involved with 6
all three meetings in 2019. I guess for me, I'd love to see Cubberley kind of like Lucie Stern, 7
providing events in South Palo Alto with the same providings like North Palo Alto has because if 8
you look at the Enjoy! catalog, most of the offerings are all in North Palo Alto, which is difficult 9
for the people in South Palo Alto, that we all have to commute up there, so it would be really 10
nice to have programming at Cubberley similar to North Palo Alto. Anyway, that's one of my 11
comments. Being a next door neighbor to Cubberley, when we've had pouring rain, it's been so 12
nice to go in the pouring rain to the current facility at Cubberley and be under those covered 13
walkways, so that's been really so nice 'cause it's not like there's anywhere else really where 14
you've had covered walkways. It seems like with your planning, it doesn't look like there's 15
covered walkways anymore. Anyway, I'm just throwing that out there. And I am a big bicyclist 16
and I don't like looking at those 90-degree angles that are on your concept because I really 17
need visibility and I don't wanna run into people with these 90-degree angle bike pathways, so 18
it needs to be – if they are 90 degrees, I need to have full visibility that I'm not gonna have a 19
bike accident with these 90-degree angles. Anyway, and I think it's great to have the flexibility 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
to provide nice things for the people in the area that when they wanna have different events 1
that they can use Cubberley's facility. Anyway, those are my comments. Thank you. 2
3
Samuel Tavera: Our next speaker is Rene B. You may now speak, Rene. 4
5
Rene Baez: Hi. Good evening. Can you hear me? 6
7
Samuel Tavera: Yes, we can. 8
9
Rene Baez: Awesome. Thank you. Hey, I wanted to say good evening, commissioners and staff. 10
Thank you for the opportunity to speak today. My name is Rene Baez and I'm here as a proud 11
representative as the Nor Cal Carpenters Union. I wanna first acknowledge and appreciate the 12
work you are all doing on this important project. This development has the potential to bring 13
real, lasting value to our community, not just in the final product but also in how it's built and 14
who builds it. I know it's still early in the planning process but whether it's a renovation or a 15
new construction, we believe this project must ultimately be awarded to a responsible general 16
contractor, one who is committed to hiring local, utilizing registered apprenticeships, and 17
providing healthcare and fair wages to their workers. It matters because when we hire local, we 18
reinvest back into our neighborhoods. Apprenticeships give young people a path to solid, debt-19
free careers and when workers are treated fairly, the entire community benefits. Our families, 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
our schools, and our local economy all benefit from this. So I just want to – I know it's still early 1
in the planning process but I wanna make sure or ensure this project isn't just something we're 2
proud of when it's finished but one we're proud of all the way through because it was built 3
responsibly with good jobs and opportunity for the people who live here. Thank you for your 4
time and all your hard work. 5
6
Samuel Tavera: Our next speaker is Elizabeth A. You may now speak, Elizabeth. 7
8
Elizabeth Alexis: Good evening. My name is Elizabeth Alexis. I too am a neighbor. I'm also a 9
volunteer at one of the organizations at Cubberly and I'm c-, extremely excited about this 10
project. I am a little bit concerned about the process in which we are just now bringing in 11
transportation because one thing I would point out as an actual cyclist – and I was the only 12
cyclist at my table during this planning – that having a grand entrance in the middle of the 13
project on Middlefield doesn't make any sense. If you're a bicyclist or a pedestrian, you're 14
gonna wanna get off of Middlefield, which is a very busy, pretty unpleasant street at that point, 15
and into the project, so the entrances should be on the corners of them. I mean, if you're a 16
bicyclist, if you're going south, that kind of could work for you if you were coming on 17
Middlefield, which most people try and avoid but if you're actually going the other direction 18
and you're – you land kind of in this space where you're gonna be on the wrong side and going 19
on the wrong side [of the 1:30:05] bicycles. So I would not think about a grand promenade on 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Middlefield. It's not a great place to be. So the main Nelson to Middlefield Road should be 1
connecting to Montrose, which is the main entrance that bicyclists use who are coming from – 2
kind of from the east side and that's what I really don't see in this project right now. 3
4
The second point I would just like to make 'cause I feel like we're trying to be all these – be too 5
nice almost in this version of the project, so we've limited ourselves to one story on 6
Middlefield, which I think is an excellent place to have a little bit of density. It would provide 7
more civic presence. I mean, we just over on Middlefie-, on Charleston, we've just built in 4-8
story [inaudible 1:30:51] housing across from similar single-story housing, which is in a smaller 9
corridor. So I think it would be appropriate to put a couple stories there up front and make 10
people see that there is something going on there. We're going to this effort to protect these 11
trees, which are mostly kind of stunted redwoods and I'm a tree person but these – I think they 12
could be replaced with better and more appropriate trees. We're talking about setbacks on 13
Middlefield. As I said, Middlefield is not a pleasant place to be. Having green space there is kind 14
of a waste. And if there is some setback, this is a City project. Those things can be changed. The 15
– I would also point out that I am not a fan of buildings that don't have right angles. I lived in 16
one as a college student and I would say it was – it created some challenges. The final thing I 17
would wanna say is as we're looking for – not just within buildings that are flexible but we 18
should leave some space for new buildings that we haven't even thought of, whether it's some 19
kind of land bank. It could be surface parking or a green space which is located in a place that 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
would make construction easy at some point. My final point would just be that be a little 1
cautious about the conclusions you make from the public meeting. It was a little bit hard for 2
people to s-, understand the scale of the buildings and how it would really function and they 3
were sort of going more on this sort of vibes thing and I think that's very different than really 4
understanding how it works. Thank you. 5
6
Samuel Tavera: Thank you. And a quick clarifying [inaudible 1:32:25] the Chair. I just wanna ask 7
– one more person has requested to speak after Gary. I just confirm if you allow that. 8
9
Chair Akin: Normally, we wouldn't but given the feedback – quality feedback we're getting 10
tonight, I think I'd like to go ahead and allow it. 11
12
Samuel Tavera: All right. Thank you. Our next speaker is gonna be Gary. After that would be 13
Stacey. Gary, you may now speak. 14
15
Female: Okay. 16
17
Samuel Tavera: Yes. [Inaudible 1:32:53]. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Gary Bradski: Yeah. Hello. This is Gary Bradski. I just had a few comments. I also concur with 1
some covered space, not just for rain but for sun that – maybe those are solar panels or 2
something. Maybe they're siding the building. I don't know but – and I'd join in with allowing 3
for future building. I lived in the Middle East and they already always built the building so that 4
you could add another story or something. At least consider that. The main I guess usage that 5
I'd like to see that doesn't really exist so much is kind of a machine shop maker space. We 6
mentioned that before and I don't see it on the current list but some place – I go, "Do I really 7
have to buy" – which I could – "a laser cutter for my garage that I'll use a little bit rather than 8
just going to a place and being able to use it?" But I – and I guess I'll end on – I am a fan more of 9
the Diagonal for the looks or the vibe but the other ones kind of seem like corporate 10
headquarters a little bit. And I'll end on that. 11
12
Samuel Tavera: Thank you. Our next speaker is Stacey A. 13
14
Stacey Ashlund: Hi. This is Stacey Ashlund. I'm a former Parks and Rec commissioner in Palo 15
Alto and a long-time participant in the dance studio, the DanceVisions at Cubberley. And I know 16
there's been a lot of talk – I've participated in the community meetings as well as the tenant 17
meetings as part of the DanceVisions group and there's been a lot of talk about what may or 18
may not exist at the new Cubberley when it is rebuilt and I just wanted to make a strong 19
statement to keep the performing arts, to keep the nonprofit dance studios that have been 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
there, like DanceVisions and [inaudible 1:35:01] that have been there over 30 years, as they are 1
the most important, multi-generational thing that is good for mental health, physical health, 2
and a sense of community, so I hope that you will keep these long-term nonprofit tenants, such 3
as the dance studios. Thank you. 4
5
Samuel Tavera: This concludes public comment. 6
7
Chair Akin: Thank you. All right, commissioners. It's time for discussion round. Let's see. I 8
believe Vice Chair Chang and then Commissioner Peterson. 9
10
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. I'll just read through some of my comments. The first big one that I 11
think others have also said, including some of our public commenters, is in the future, when 12
we're presenting these types of concepts, it's really helpful because of the scale of the space – 13
it's – I mean, I don't know what an acre looks like but I do have more of a sense what 100 feet 14
looks like, so I think we need a legend on these things that say, "This is a bike path, this is a ped 15
path, and this is what 100 feet" – or whatever unit looks – whatever the unit is because that – 16
so it was very difficult to give good feedback regarding the six topics that – and it might be 17
helpful, actually, if we pull those six topics up so that we – the commissioners can refer to that 18
as we give our comments. So then – I probably should've asked these already but is a pool 19
gonna be – is a pool one of the use cases that's currently in – on the list or not? Because one of 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
the videos I watched online said an outdoor space could include things like a swimming pool, so 1
I just wasn't su-, is it in or is it out or do we know? 2
3
Kristen O’Kane: Sure. So we used the word "green space" originally but we're trying to start to 4
use "outdoor space"... 5
6
Vice Chair Chang: Mm-hm. 7
8
Kristen O’Kane: ...because what we're just showing is what will be buildings, what will be 9
circulation, and what will be outdoor, so there could be some programming or outdoor 10
facilities, like recreational facilities that go in those outdoor spaces. A pool might be one of 11
them. We're still working through what would go where within this site... 12
13
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. 14
15
Kristen O’Kane: ...but we're not quite there yet. 16
17
Vice Chair Chang: Presumably with the request for a bond measure and a master plan, that 18
would be specified. Correct? 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Kristen O’Kane: Yes. 1
2
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. All right. Also, I should've asked this but the yellow lines I believe are 3
pedestrian paths, right? So there's this pedestrian path that I believe – if I'm orienting myself 4
correctly, on the right side of all the options, the concepts, that one's right in front of Piazza's, 5
possibly because there's a fence there right now but it's a Piazza's parking lot, and so one of my 6
pieces of feedback is that that is probably not a good pedestrian pathway because that would 7
be the front of the grocery store and that corridor is one that you avoid because there's tons of 8
cars circulating. It's dangerous. That is not where we really want people going, I don't think, so 9
that was one of my pieces of... 10
11
Commissioner Templeton: Rick's is there. I'm just saying. 12
13
Vice Chair Chang: Well, Rick's is there but I'm not – so I'm not saying we wouldn't go through 14
the – that we wouldn't go through the Charleston Center but I'm not sure that's the line 15
because that's – at least right now the way car traffic circulates in that lot, it's really, really 16
dangerous. The analogy is in front of Walmart in Mountain View, you want to avoid at all costs 17
that front driveway right in front of the store 'cause it's just kind of crazy and it is also in front of 18
Piazza's, so that's just – that's if I'm understanding correctly there. Regarding being a good 19
neighbor, I wondered if Charleston Center and Piazza's have been consulted regarding this. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Amanda Deml: Yes, they have. And to clarify your first comment, there's already an opening in 2
the gate, so there's already a walkway, and so the plans are just to make it better, safer, more 3
of a throughway, so we've been consulting with those businesses, including Piazza's and the 4
property owner and we recently actually just sent them the updated concept plans to review 5
and be able to provide feedback on, so we've been keeping them updated throughout the 6
process. So at the moment, it's a small gate opening but there is an opening in the fence, and so 7
we want to essentially just make it – drive foot traffic there, hopefully make this kind of a 8
positive relationship for both... 9
10
Vice Chair Chang: Understood. 11
12
Amanda Deml: ...of the... 13
14
Vice Chair Chang: But... 15
16
Amanda Deml: ...sites. 17
18
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Vice Chair Chang: ...it's more that there's – it's indicating that this is an entranceway but not 1
necessarily the path through – that's going through their parking lot necessarily, right? We 2
don't... 3
4
Commissioner Templeton: [Inaudible 1:40:14]. 5
6
Vice Chair Chang: There are some. There's also EV charging right now, which makes that whole 7
area even more hazardous, so that's just something to think about, right? There's people 8
circling. 9
10
Amanda Deml: Right. 11
12
Vice Chair Chang: It's just not a lovely place. 13
14
Vice Chair Chang: Yeah. Elizabeth... 15
16
Vice Chair Chang: Right. 17
18
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Amanda Deml: ...or Steven, if they wanna speak to – I don't know if we've fleshed out exactly 1
once you get onto their site. I think right now we're just gonna make that entrance over to their 2
site just more open... 3
4
Vice Chair Chang: Yeah. That makes sense. 5
6
Amanda Deml: ...and safe. 7
8
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. That makes sense to me. But in terms of... 9
10
Amanda Deml: Yeah. 11
12
Vice Chair Chang: ...act-... 13
14
Amanda Deml: And it looks like Elizabeth can add more there. 15
16
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. 17
18
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Elizabeth Chen: I think you said it all, Amanda. Yes. The – we're intending for that to be an 1
access point. The yellow line is not to be taken literally, just as a trajectory that connects those 2
two sites together. 3
4
Steven Bingler: But we will be drilling down on that and figuring out at a higher level of detail in 5
the next iteration. 6
7
Vice Chair Chang: Okay. Thank you. Regarding the parking, I think I, like many members of the 8
public, think that the h-, the underground parking solution would be better both aesthetically 9
as well as in terms of using the space but another thought that I had and a piece of feedback 10
was that, again, I have – I'm having a hard time with the scale but it's a very large site and if the 11
parking were all in a surface lot in a corner of the lot, that would mean that there's actually a 12
very large walking distance potentially, and so the idea of a parking lot that's underground but 13
that stretches across the whole site, I like that because it means that for people who might be 14
more mobility challenged, that they could park closer to where they ultimately need to go, so I 15
thought that was an added benefit. And then I also gravitated towards Option 1 but again, a 16
little hard – much – I agree with much of what public commenter Elizabeth Alexis said where 17
there's a little bit of vibes on this 'cause it's hard for me to understand the scale. I gravitated 18
towards the larger spaces but one of the things – as I thought about what Lucie Stern offers 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
versus what we have here right now in South Palo Alto is Lucie Stern has a courtyard, the Lucie 1
Stern courtyard, which is a nice outdoor space that can be used in a semi-private setting. 2
3
So if you have large open spaces, it's hard to say have a career fair going on in one space and a 4
band in another space and if somebody wanted say a wedding ceremony or an outdoor 5
reception of some sort, it might be nice to have a smaller green space that is available in option 6
– a smaller outdoor space 'cause I think – I mean, I can't imagine all the particular uses that 7
there might be but I do know that other community centers have outdoor spaces where people 8
can have weddings or parties or whatever but that are semi-private that wouldn't – if 9
everything's wide open, it's not as conducive to that. So that's just a be-, one of the few things 10
that I liked about Concept 2. And then in general, I wasn't in love with these huge, wide 11
promenades because I was h-, and again, that was why I asked the question, the clarifying 12
question. I j-, maybe I'm not being imaginative enough in terms of what I would use a long 13
walkway outdoor space for. Great for farmer's market. Maybe great for some sort of tabling. 14
I'm thinking college campuses. When I see a large, wide –a large, somewhat long open space, 15
what do we do there? Yeah. Tables to sit by but is that the best use of the space? And you can't 16
use it for a lot of other things, so I think that it may actually limit some flexibility. 17
18
And then in terms of being a good neighbor, I think I concur with what Ms. Alexis was saying 19
about, "I'm not so sure that it's that important for us to limit the massing on Middlefield as it is 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
and – I mean, sure, it might be appreciated but I'm not – it's across the street. It's – there – if 1
done well, it could actually be nice to show that there's stuff going on here and it could also be 2
made welcoming that way, so I'm not married to that idea. I think it's nice to be thoughtful 3
about it for circulation. I agree, right now Middlefield in that section is not a nice place to be 4
and there's a real – I think as was highlighted, there's no crosswalk currently right there in the 5
middle and if that were supposed to be some sort of entrance, it would be – it would require 6
some additional planning. Coming at the corners might make a lot more sense. 7
8
And then finally, the last piece is if those athletic fields are in the back – 'cause it seems like in 9
all the concepts, there's the idea that there'd be some athletic fields next to the recreation 10
center/gym. If that's the case, and if people are using it for say soccer or other youth activities, 11
what parents like to do is drop their kids off as close as possible to the field and also people are 12
schlepping a lot of equipment and, again, I think the distances here are pretty large. I found 13
myself constantly flipping back and forth between Google Maps and these diagrams to try and 14
understand, "Well, how long would it take for me to walk from Point A to Point B?" So I wonder 15
about the mobility hub and whether there's the need for some ability to drop off because if I’m 16
a parent with a 5-year-old, I'm not sure I want to drop them off someplace and then say, "Okay. 17
Bye-bye. I can't see where you're going. I don't have line of sight. I don't know if you're gonna 18
get where you're going." So I would – that would involve parking, walking a substantial 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
distance, and then parki-, so circulation-wise, particularly with the athletics facilities, it might be 1
important to have some sort of mobility hub/drop-off area over there. That's it. Thank you. 2
3
Chair Akin: Thank you, Vice Chair. I have Commissioner Peterson and then Commissioner 4
Hechtman. 5
6
Commissioner Peterson: Thank you, Chair. I appreciated the comment on the boulevard. I 7
hadn't thought about that. What is this space used for? That's a good comment. So the 8
walkway to what essentially is the food court next door gets a lot of use at lunch particularly. I 9
don't know how many years I've sat there while my daughter was in dance school but I know 10
that walkway through the fence pretty well, running over there due – 'cause the grocery store 11
next door has really awesome food to go. So that's – the view that's up right now, actually – I 12
mean, the site – the – one of these views has the grand corridor coming from Middlefield but 13
really this site – the grand corridor at this site really is basically from the shopping center over 14
to the housing and that's where you see most of the traffic coming from is people walking onto 15
that site, actually from the midpoint into the site and not necessarily from the Middlefield 16
street. Even – one of the callers mentioned that really – this site, you don't access it from the 17
center. You access from the corners... 18
19
Female: Mm-hm. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Peterson: ...because that's where the crosswalks are, so there's really – nobody 2
is ever in the middle of that site very often, unless they can't find parking somewhere. So with 3
that, let me bring up another topic. I'm gonna try and share my screen and draw a little bit, so 4
have some patience with me as I try to figure this out. Oh. Nope. Let's try that again. Share my 5
screen. Thank you, Sam. It says "broadcast" but that's not what I want. 6
7
Samuel Tavera: So [inaudible 1:48:50] and then you can share your screen. Are you – and you're 8
sharing your map or what is it that you wanna share? 9
10
Commissioner Peterson: Yeah. I got a map on the screen that I wanna share. 11
12
Samuel Tavera: Oh. [Inaudible 1:49:08] URL or a website or... 13
14
Commissioner Peterson: I guess we can see it. Maybe it'll bring it up. No. [Inaudible 1:49:17]. As 15
soon as you press... 16
17
Samuel Tavera: Yeah. 18
19
Commissioner Peterson: ...screen, it should... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Samuel Tavera: Yeah. 2
3
Commissioner Peterson: ...share the screen. Let's see what it does. Maybe it'll do something. 4
Well, did it work that time? It did. 5
6
Samuel Tavera: Yeah. 7
8
Commissioner Peterson: You fixed it. All right. I didn't do that on purpose, just be like, "I don't 9
know what I'm doing," just so you can – okay. There... 10
11
Samuel Tavera: Yeah. 12
13
Commissioner Peterson: ...we go. 14
15
Samuel Tavera: Yeah. 16
17
Commissioner Peterson: Let's see. 18
19
Samuel Tavera: Yeah. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Peterson: Perfect. 2
3
Samuel Tavera: There you go. 4
5
Commissioner Peterson: All right. Let's see. Okay. So this is the comment I brought up earlier, 6
that I would say this is easily the most complicated walking path in all of Palo Alto and I think 7
I've walked every walking path in Palo Alto and this one here actually terrifies me. To go from 8
that Caltrain station to the Cubberley Center, you have to cross Alma, which I mean, if you 9
make that alone, it's like that old – what was that game with the... 10
11
Vice Chair Chang: Frogger. 12
13
Commissioner Peterson: Yes. Yeah. With the log and the alligators. Yeah. So you make it across 14
Alma and then you don't know where you are. You're totally lost. You're in a commercial 15
parking lot. This is the first time I found out if you continue through that parking lot – I never – 16
that's as far as I made it. I called a Lyft at that point and – so this site – and once – and there are 17
walkways. I tried about six different ways and this would not pick – if you look in the corner 18
there, what is that? Ferne and Fima? Ferne and... 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Vice Chair Chang: It's Ferne. 1
2
Commissioner Peterson: ...Ferne, there's a walkway that goes into the school site. And to get to 3
the school site from San Antonio is actually somewhat annoying because to get to Cubberley 4
from San Antonio, you can't actually just kind of walk there. You have to go all the way around 5
to Middlefield or you gotta go all the way back around to the back of the school and – so if 6
you're trying to get to say the shopping center, it's – I don't know why the site's like that. It has 7
some of the pathways there. Once you learn they're there, you figure out how to get onto the 8
site and off of it but that's my feedback is really be cognizant that this site kind of has subtle 9
access points to it that have just evolved over time but aren't really that apparent. But really 10
the Caltrain, I think we're all looking to maximize public transportation, the Caltrain. Now we're 11
– obviously you can't solve the Caltrain – full pathway to the Caltrain but definitely be aware 12
that there are subtleties to this site that make it difficult. And I'm also – I do a lot of mentoring 13
for architectural teams at the university and I am the mentor that always is saying, "Look at the 14
3-mile circle around the site and draw your lines out from there." I'm always asking them how 15
are they going to bring their material into the site from the freeway and all the rest, so I know 16
I'm that one comment that's always gonna ask for the pathway. So with that, my next comment 17
is I want to – and this one here is a question as well. Is – have you envisioned what material is 18
going to be used for this site? Is this going to be a timber construction? Is this steel or is this 19
concrete or are you 100 percent not specifying or even have an idea? 'Cause my colleague over 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
here brought up the great quote by Vitruvi, which is "Form follows function," and then the 1
second quote after that, Vitruvi said, "Make sure you build with something that's nearby." 2
3
Steven Bingler: Yeah. We won't be involved in the material selection at this stage. Master 4
planning it, we're not gonna be – that'll be happening in the architectural phase. 5
6
Commissioner Peterson: So does your massing have any effect on that? 'Cause some – there 7
are some configurations that favor one or another. 8
9
Steven Bingler: The massing that we're developing can be built in any of those materials. 10
11
Commissioner Peterson: Okay. Sounds good. Thank you. 12
13
Jennifer Armer: And through the chair, first a request maybe if you could stop sharing just so 14
that we can see everybody here in the room. But I also did wanna share based on that 15
comment and question from Commissioner Peterson that we do anticipate bringing a 16
discussion of the early stages of the San Antonio Road Area Plan to the Planning and 17
Transportation Commission in September. 18
19
Chair Akin: Thank you, Ms. Armer. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Steven Bingler: [Great 1:53:52]. 2
3
Chair Akin: That's good to know. 4
5
Steven Bingler: [Great 1:53:53]. 6
7
Chair Akin: All right. Next, Commissioner Hechtman followed by Commissioner Templeton. 8
9
Commissioner Hechtman: Thank you, Chair. So in this round, I really wanna talk about a couple 10
of high-level, kind of big picture items and then in my next round, I will address the feedback 11
requests. So the first kind of big picture point I wanna make is this is a project that started in 12
1991, and so what that tells me is that even in 1991, there was significant momentum and 13
recognition that this needs to be different, this needs to be better. It started, it stopped, it 14
started again, got stopped by COVID, and now we're starting again and I'm really happy. I 15
enjoyed reading the staff report because it gave me a sense of forward motion, that it could 16
really happen this time and it needs to. It really needs to. In 1991, I had just moved to Palo Alto 17
as a baby lawyer and even if this moves forward at the pace which it looks like it can, by the 18
time the first shovel goes in the ground, I will be retired. And that's not very long from now. So 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
it's long overdue and I'm really happy it's here and I appreciate the work that staff and the 1
consultants have been doing and let's just sort of keep the pressure on to move this forward. 2
3
So my other big-picture point is as I read through the staff report and was thinking about 4
Cubberley, where my family has a lot of history and a lot of people have a lot of history with 5
Cubberley from all kinds of different angles but it made me think about the JCC and how when 6
it was built, I wanna say maybe 15 years ago, it was really transformative– but it was 7
transformative for a segment of our community, the segment that pays the membership. And 8
there are some things that members of the public can do there but primarily, it was 9
transformative for that segment. But when I think about Cubberley and this master plan, I think 10
it can be and I think it will be transformative for Palo Alto because it's our community center. I 11
mean, this plan, it dwarfs Lucie Stern. It's gonna be enormous and it's really gonna be this focal 12
point for everyone and there's no membership required. Of course, there will be classes you 13
pay fees for, theater that you buy a ticket, but it's gonna be a transformative space and when I 14
think about that and I think that to make it happen, we don't have a budget yet but it's going to 15
be large. I mean, when you just look at the buildings here, it's gonna be a big number and that 16
number's gonna be presented in the form of a bond to our taxpayers, our citizens. 17
18
And what it made me think of is in this community, we have a number of individuals with 19
extraordinary wealth and a lot of those individuals have displayed a capacity for extraordinary 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
philanthropy. And I think this is the kind of project, a community project that could attract 1
some major donations, $10, $20, $30 million. Maybe there's some naming rights on buildings 2
that are involved but I think this would be an attractive opportunity for a segment of our 3
community to contribute and relieve the taxpayers of some of the cost associated that would 4
be in that bond measure. And so I bring that up because we're well over a year from that bond 5
measure and I would encourage staff to give that idea some thought about whether it has legs 6
and there might be an interest in some people in this community or companies participating in 7
the funding for this project. So those are my big-picture items. Thanks. 8
9
Chair Akin: Thank you. I have Commissioner Templeton next followed by Commissioner Ji. 10
11
Commissioner Templeton: Thank you. I really appreciate what you said, Commissioner 12
Hechtman. I'm not gonna touch on that. I am gonna reflect on some of the comments that 13
we've heard. I do think you're right to keep the entranceway from this property to the adjacent 14
property with the shopping center, so I don't think we need to say more about that but it is 15
definitely a favorite of the kids that were participating in activities close to that area, so that's 16
the other thing I wanna talk about. We heard some public comments about this but we wanna 17
make sure that – we've heard about sports and we heard about theater but there's plenty of 18
other kinds of movement that's gonna be important to our community at every age level, so I 19
do appreciate the caller who mentioned making sure we keep the dance space and that we 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
have that in mind but also the ability to drop off, like Commissioner Chang said, being able to 1
drop off our kids easily at those places and be able to, if we choose, wait and shop and go pick 2
them back up. So I think that is something that is a use case that doesn't appear to be 3
represented in these designs, so when you do your next iteration, I'm really hoping to see a 4
little bit more activities towards the sides in terms of parking and waiting. There's not currently 5
a lot of great waiting spaces. I think there's one picnic table that may have recently disappeared 6
down there. Anyway, so that's something to think about. We need to have those kind of 7
movement spaces. 8
9
I like the concept of the pool and that is a major construction project, so it should be 10
represented in the designs if it's going to be part of them, so not having it here speaks volumes 11
and I can tell you in South Palo Alto, we are grateful for Rinconada but very frustrated when it 12
fills up, right? That's a – and we have a lot of pools at the schools but those are for meets and 13
not for recreational use, so we do need to see more of that kind of movement as well, so that's 14
another sport that could be housed here. 15
16
Another comment that Commissioner Chang brought up but I think – I'm gonna comment on 17
two parts of what she said. One as far as what could the space be used for, when my kids were 18
little, we spent a lot of time at the Stanford Oval. There was nothing there, there was no – 19
nothing but a picnic blanket and a frisbee but thank God for that because I could get a nap and 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
they could get some activity and get worn out. So I do appreciate that that kind of space is 1
included in the design but if we're now being a little bit ambiguous about is that space designed 2
for a lawn use or a forest or a pool use or a tennis court use or pickleball – if that is up in the air 3
and not part of this design, it's gonna be really hard to satisfy people at the polls, if that makes 4
sense, right? We're gonna find people making a lot of promises and people expecting different 5
outcomes, so I would really think about eat least narrowing down what spaces are up for 6
construction for the outdoor use versus open lawn versus some other kind of planting. 7
8
And then the other comment about something that Commissioner Chang said was pictures and 9
this – it sounds so silly but it's not. It – why should my kid drive to a pretty house in Saratoga to 10
get her prom pictures taken with her friends? Okay. Lucie Stern is a good option. It's small. It's 11
not gonna house a lot of people. Are we gonna make this place a beautiful place to hang out, to 12
have a party, to have a photo shoot with your family, right? What is something that gives back 13
and pushes a little further than the use of the buildings but helps enhance our enjoyment of our 14
community? So I would like to see some of those alcoves and some of those smaller meeting 15
areas. We do have really nice meeting room in the c-, Mitchell Park Community Center but 16
that's not the same and they're not built for outdoor beauty and a place to sit and relax. 17
They're for use, active use as a meeting indoors. So I would like to imagine this Cubberley space 18
in that way of being outdoors and really getting something special for – from it even if you 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
don't have a specific activity or if you're a parent waiting for your child at an activity or if you're 1
a sibling waiting for your other sibling to finish something. 2
3
And then the drop-off points. That whole discussion about the grand entrance, I'm really 4
enamored with the romance of the idea. I do echo some of the feedback we've heard tonight 5
about the placement, so I would ask our friends to imagine from a very practical standpoint of 6
welcoming people where they're actually coming in and enhancing safety. So the person – I 7
don't remember who mentioned this or maybe multiple people did – who mentioned that 8
Middlefield is a very busy road, it's important to know that it's busy partly because of Cubberley 9
but partly because it's a commute home and so there's often a lot of people in a hurry, hustling 10
down that road, trying to either pick up their child, go get the groceries, or arrive home, and so 11
we don't want people walking on there. We – if we have the beautiful space of Cubberley 12
available, wouldn't it be nice to have that path go a little further from the road like we're 13
walking people through in front of the new buildings and through a beautiful space to get from 14
the Charleston side towards the San Antonio side. So from a safety perspective, I'd like to have 15
a little bit more excitement about the pedestrian path adjacent to Middlefield, if we could, and 16
I don't know how that would play out with the bikes. I mean, obviously they're gonna wanna go 17
the most efficient route. We do want bikes to be comfortable using that space adjacent to the 18
road. But if they don't, if they're a child perhaps or somebody less confident, maybe they can 19
come inside this space as well, so just thinking about all of these different perspectives. One is 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
beauty and enjoyment and being able to have a special space within the site and the other is 1
safety and those are just some things we haven't really put at the forefront of the discussion. I'd 2
love to hear that in the next round. Thank you. 3
4
Chair Akin: Thank you, Commissioner Templeton. Commissioner Ji, you're up next. 5
6
Commissioner Ji: Thank you, Chair. I'll, like Commissioner Hechtman, kind of talk about my 7
overall thoughts first and then go into the specifics at my next round. I actually want to echo a 8
lot about kind of it being a transformative space. So I actually grew up here in Palo Alto and 9
when I was in high school, the Mitchell Park Community Center opened up and I was able to go 10
to youth council there, so I have a very strong tie to the Community Services Department, did a 11
lot of programming there and so I really appreciate and am really excited about the work being 12
done here. I think a lot of – and I wanna also echo Commissioner Templeton and Vice Chair 13
Chang about the different usages. On packet page 19, it describes the open green space as one 14
of the outdoor programs followed by a playground, amphitheater, or pool water area. Those 15
are very different, right, so just gonna comment on that again. 16
17
I also kind of would like to think about the usage. I kind of alluded to this during my questioning 18
pha-, the opening questions and clarifying questions phase but I think a lot of the community 19
members when talking to me have talked a lot about usage and you can kind of hear that a lot 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
in the public comments as well. It's like, "I want a maker space. I want a dance studio." And I 1
think that from the public's perspective, sure there are some comments on, "Oh, we want a 2
bike path to X and Y," but I think having a diamond-shaped building or a square-shaped building 3
I think isn't quite the right question to be asking the public. I think it's a lot about, "Oh, well, 4
what do you actually want to do here?" and then from the activities be able to say, "Okay. We 5
trust professional architects in a later phase to be able to go through and make sure that the 6
community needs are met." And again, I think it's very hard to comment on whether – which 7
designs are good if, for example, the theater can't fit in the diagonally-shaped building and 8
things like that. 9
10
Another thing that I think hasn't been brought up yet is the intersection between different 11
community spaces. So the way I think about it is in North Palo Alto, you have Rinconada serving 12
a certain set of experiences, a playground, a pool, library, while Lucie Stern serves other 13
services, for example, the theater and a bunch of other things like that. Yeah. And I think that 14
given that Cubberley is let's say one block away from Mitchell Park, I think it could be really 15
interesting to think about do we want to – what is the intersection between these two use 16
cases, right? Do we – given that Mitchell Park is a lot of open field, is the correct usage for 17
Cubberley more open field? Right? I'm not sure the answer is yes or no, but I think it's really 18
important to think about and I want to echo what Commissioner Templeton said about having 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
somewhere like Lucie Stern in the south side. Mitchell Park isn't quite serving some of those use 1
cases right now but I think it could be really interesting to think about. 2
3
And I also want to allude to a public commenter who had mentioned Enjoy! catalog given that 4
that's a big part of the Community Services Department. Selection I think could be really 5
interesting to go and say, "Hey, do we have somewhat parity or do we – maybe we want to 6
plan to have some kind of parity at some point based on the usages here." And then separately, 7
myself as a biker – I won't kind of harp on this too much but I will say I definitely use the side 8
entrances. I live on I guess the Alma side, so I definitely come in through the back, so I do use 9
that. And I also do believe that when I come in from the car, the Montrose side is probably 10
where I'd consider adding more transportation options but I'll reserve my additional comments 11
for the next round. 12
13
Chair Akin: Commissioner James, anything for this round? 14
15
Commissioner James: Yeah. I have to confess I'm really struggling with this and I think it's – I 16
ter-, I completely understand the kind of gentle pushback from my comments that it feels a 17
little abstract and a little arbitrary, like the – geometrically arbitrary but I would invite you, if it's 18
not, supply the reasoning. Supply the design reasoning and start labeling things and say what 19
they are. I just – I really, really am s-, am having a problem with – we're seeing bike paths, we're 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
seeing foot paths, and we're showing polygons that add up to a certain square footage but I 1
feel like – and I almost feel like we're being asked to sort of ask, "Well, which bike path do you 2
like and which pedestrian path?" And then that's gonna lock us into these buildings. And maybe 3
I'm misunderstanding and maybe the only thing is because Ms. O'Kane, you were saying, "What 4
we're really trying to show here" – and I – if I'm understanding you correctly is, "We're trying to 5
show where the buildings, the circulation, and the outdoor space," and that's a lot more 6
general than what I think I'm seeing here and I am – we're both told that it's very early in the 7
process and if I heard correctly, it's like, "Well, but we're gonna pick one and we're gonna go to 8
concept with it and then we're gonna have to sort of have the voters sort of act on that." 9
10
And I still don't know why you broke these buildings up in this – what are you putting in these 11
buildings and why did you decide to stack these two over here and those over there? There's 12
just – you're just not – you're not giving me something to buy into and I'm sorry to sort of be – 13
I'm not gonna win a popularity contest here but I am really struggling with you asking me to 14
sort of pick which one I like based on what kind of geometry. I just don't think that's enough. 15
I'm sorry. I mean, I am very excited about this space. I am very excited about having a place for 16
a creative – supports creative individual and collective creativity, wonderful space, the most 17
amazing piece of land that I've seen that's underdeveloped in Palo Alto. I want it to be the Ri-, 18
to me, the standard is the Rinconada Library, which I think was beautifully designed in the mid 19
century by Edward Durell Stone and it is aesthetically gorgeous. It is – it functions beautifully. It 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
enhances the environment. These are – we get to do this once and I think you're just asking me 1
to raise my hand and say, "I vote for that one," way before – and when I do, I feel like I'm 2
closing out a lot of options for the architect that comes next. I'm sorry. I'm just being very 3
forthright with you and I have a real problem with that. I mean, if you're saying to me, "We've 4
got this amount of square footage," but I mean, so w-, these are 70 – these are rectangles that 5
are 70 feet wide or whatever they are. So because – which I think is great to know that that 6
really accommodates but are we stacking them like shipping containers? Why did you put those 7
there and what is that? I just don't think you've provided me with a convincing case and a 8
design rationale for why you did this geometry this way. I'm sorry. 9
10
Chair Akin: Thank you, Commissioner. As always, I admire the insight of my fellow 11
commissioners up here. You have all touched on things that would never have occurred to me 12
and changed my view of several aspects of this project. With that, I think I'm going to start the 13
transition over to some of the more specific requests that you made. So let's see. Regarding 14
adjacency, most of my concerns have been addressed. The one that I'd like to emphasize is that 15
I think a 4-story parking structure next to Greendell probably doesn't work and that obviously is 16
an opinion shared by many people. I also am willing to accept a little more height, a little more 17
density along Middlefield. There are several reasons for that. One is if it helps to support the 18
below-grade parking, then it – that's a worthwhile tradeoff. If it helps provide a flood buffer, 19
that might also be a consideration worth keeping in mind. And finally, the greater context of 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
this project is we expect to have a dramatic expansion of housing along San Antonio and I think 1
one of the unavoidable consequences of that is that there is going to be more traffic on 2
Middlefield, so I would like to use some of that height, some of that density, some of those 3
buildings as a buffer between Middlefield and the rest of the Cubberley development. The 4
various concepts have different tradeoffs in that respect. The Diagonal Concept I think does the 5
best job of using the buildings to buffer the remainder of the development from Middlefield. As 6
soon as you put a nice rectilinear path that goes at a right angle from Middlefield all the way 7
through the depth of the project, then you have line of sight and line of sound way back into 8
the project and the Diagonal Concept did a better job of breaking up that path. 9
10
Also with respect to the Diagonal Project, one of the things that I always look at when 11
presented with a larger area plan is where are the desire paths going to be? If I'm at a given 12
spot and I'm trying to get to another spot, am I going to take the path that's provided or am I 13
going to cut through? And the diagonal layout I think does a better job of preventing the 14
creation of desire paths. The rectilinear – the two more rectilinear concepts, you're gonna get 15
diagonals through whatever – through that outdoor space. That's partly because of the people 16
taking the shortest distance and partly because of the size of the project and the entrance 17
points are going to encourage that. So whatever final design is determined, please keep that in 18
mind. I am not so fond of the small courtyard in the Grid Concept, Concept Number 2, because 19
it makes it harder to repurpose land and I think there's a decent chance that within the lifetime 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
of this project, we'll be expanding buildings, so for each layout, I also tried to look at it as a, "If I 1
needed to build on, where would I do it?" And partitioning the outdoor space into too many 2
small units makes that more difficult. And finally, along those lines, in Concept 3, the grand 3
promenade, it's so hard to use that for anything else that that – I think that represents a 4
commitment of total available space that may be too large. So it sounds like you're already 5
thinking along those lines but I'd just like to emphasize that. So yeah. 6
7
In summary, the parking structure next to Greendell, the use of construction along Middlefield 8
to buffer the rest of the development from potential increases in traffic on Middlefield and 9
efficient – particularly walking access. Oh, that reminds me. The question I asked earlier about 10
whether the bicycle paths would also have walking paths accompanying them is related to that. 11
If you say, "Well, there are electric bikes that make it impractical for safety reasons to have 12
people walking along the bike promenades," then you've created a huge incentive for people to 13
generate more walking paths, whereas if those paths can be used for walking as well as biking 14
safely, then I think that's a worthwhile design feature. All right. I think that's everything on my 15
list, so I believe we are ready for the next round of comments from commissioners. I have 16
Commissioner Hechtman first and then Commissioner Peterson and then Commissioner Ji. 17
18
Commissioner Hechtman: All right. Thank you. So I'm looking at the list, which is also in our 19
packet, 14. So arrival and parking. It's interesting. I showed my wife the plans and we've had 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
many activities at Cubberly, starting with pre-school family, and dance and all kinds of things, so 1
she's spent a lot of time there and her first reaction was something that Vice Chair Chang 2
mentioned about the 4-story parking garage. And that was that it is on one side of the property 3
and there are all kinds of people with mobility issues – parents with small children, the elderly, 4
disabled people – and to have them necessarily cross the entire campus is a lot to ask. I think 5
partially underground parking that is spread across the whole face of the property really 6
answers that issue, and so I think that's important. 7
8
Pedestrian circulation. I see this word pedestrian but I'm really thinking pedestrian and bike – 9
bicycle circulation for this one. And really – I bike and I guess one of the things that struck me is 10
if I'm biking to get to Cubberley and some building, then that's one thing, but a lot of the plan 11
here is to get bicyclists through Cubberley out to Nelson. And if I'm one of those bicyclists, I 12
really don't want to spend the trip through Cubberley dodging pedestrians who are crossing, 13
not walking the same path but actually crossing from these buildings to those buildings. And so 14
I would think for the bike circulation, around the outside might be better and I raise these 15
things and I know there's a group of people that have been studying this stuff since 2019 and so 16
maybe there's a reason that doesn't work so well but if so, maybe that should be told to us. But 17
to me, that makes a lot more sense. Take the through-bikers out of the middle of the campus. 18
And when you do that, then I think you have a lot more flexibility with the pedestrian 19
circulation because they're not at risk of being run over by an electric or human-powered bike. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Building scale and physical space organization. I look at all three of these plans and it's 280,000 2
square feet of building and I really look at that as just a very fungible product. I understand 3
what's been told to us by the consultant and I think it's right that these buildings will have a 4
certain shape but within that building, you'll be able to carve it up in all kinds of different ways. 5
There can be small spaces. There can be large spaces. Apparently there's a specific plan for a 6
space that's large enough for four courts. There's gonna be something that's big enough for a 7
theater. And so as I look at the plans, because I feel that those buildings are kind of fungible in 8
the different shapes and locations, I really tend to focus on the area around the buildings, the 9
green space, and how will that best be used to be community space. 10
11
And that really takes me to sort of my favorite of the three designs, which – and I feel like, from 12
what I've heard, I may be in the minority here but I really like the linear version. When I first 13
looked at that and I looked at that grand promenade, the first thing I thought of – and 14
Commissioner Templeton mentioned it earlier – the first thing I thought of was the Stanford 15
Oval, right, which is just a big circle with grass in it. But on a nice day, it's full of people and it's 16
not just Stanford students. It's full of people from the community who come there 'cause it's 17
just a nice space. Then the second thing that it made me think of was the Great Mall, of course, 18
in Washington, where you are inviting people into a space where they can gather. Now when I 19
look at the design and I'm looking at packet page 35, I don't fully understand it because it looks 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
to me like you've got the orange – what I think are the sidewalks on the outside and then 1
maybe these black dashes inside. I know one of the consultants mentioned there would be 2
separate bike and pedestrian and if that's what's inside of the orange, then you're squeezing 3
the open area down to – if that whole thing is 200 feet, you're squeezing that grass in between 4
all of the bike and pedestrian paths down to, I don't know, 40 feet, which isn't big enough. 5
6
So I think if we wanna make – I think it would be a great design because it would just be a 7
central meeting place and I like it in combination with the front promenade along Middlefield, 8
because when I looked at that, what I think about is Lucie Stern and how we have the glass 9
pumpkin sale and there's another arts and crafts thing. I get those fliers that they're coming. I 10
forget. And then I'm going down Embarcadero and there it is and I remember – and I go around 11
the back and park and I enjoy those things and I can see this front promenade along Middlefield 12
serving that kind of function with the booths extending down the grand promenade. I can see 13
political gatherings in this kind of space because it's so open in the middle. We had the No Kings 14
Rally, right, which practically overwhelmed Rinconada. It needs a big space and I hope that our 15
citizenry will continue to stay vocal and this opening, this middle opening with the grand 16
promenade and the big green spaces on the side could accommodate that kind of use, so I 17
really like that. And, again, particularly if you take the bikes out of the middle, which is one of 18
the reasons I sort of didn't like the diagonal, is because you've got these two nice, big spaces 19
but you're funneling all of your bike traffic in between them. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Balance of building and green space. I've been listening to some of the commissioners talk 2
about maybe future expansion, right? We might need to build more buildings. It's impressive to 3
me that with the figures we've shown, we're actually getting more green space in all of these 4
than we currently have, so if we're gonna think about reducing green space in the future from I 5
think 335,000 square feet is the figure – by adding to the 280,000 square feet of building, we 6
wanna create a hard line. I mean, I don't think we ever wanna go below the amount of green 7
space that we have at Cubberley today, and that figure was shown. I just don't remember it. 8
Because it is a lot of green space and, as has been pointed out, not very far away, we have 9
Mitchell Park with a lot more green space. 10
11
And then the last point I'll make to – the discussion about possibly putting more height on the 12
buildings along Middlefield. This commission has shown great sensitivity to scale across from 13
single-family residents and I think this design reflects that kind of thought. What I see is 14
Middlefield's a wide road. Particularly if you keep this big grass promenade, there's enough of a 15
buffer that you can have a second floor because even a second floor is gonna be well under 35 16
feet, which is what we'd be looking at to build right next to residential, much less behind a 17
promenade and across a wide street, so if more square footage is desirable or shifting forward 18
to that, I think those are reasonable ideas but I do understand why the current planning kept 19
the front low and sort of scaled back with more elevation in sort of the second row. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
And in terms of being a good neighbor, I guess when I read that, I'm thinking about are we 2
adversely affecting the immediately surrounding properties, and so we just talked about that 3
across Middlefield. We've got a school just to the south of us. We've got ball fields behind us 4
that stay, right? The oval track and then the big soccer fields. And then we've got commercial, 5
Piazza to one side. And so really, I think the only real sensitivity is in what I think is the 6
northwest corner where you've got some single-family homes. And what we're showing here is 7
a pretty wide distance between the nearest buildings, at least in the linear approach, and 8
you've got a lot of green space over there, and so I think these designs are being a good 9
neighbor, so those are my points on the six. Thanks. 10
11
Chair Akin: Thank you. Commissioner Peterson, you're next. 12
13
Commissioner Peterson: Thank you, Chair. Let's see if I can figure out the share this time. Let's 14
see. There we go. And all right. I'm gonna follow up on the comment made by Commissioner Ji 15
that I also agree that looking at Mitchell Park and the Cubberley as a single site, I didn't realize 16
there was a walkway between these. It's only a 10-minute walk between these two sites if you 17
know the walkway. Otherwise, it's – I mean, they're worlds apart if you don't know that there's 18
a walkway here. And let me check. I think there's a way I can draw. Where is the draw feature? 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Male: [Inaudible 2:32:54]. 1
2
Commissioner Peterson: Okay. And where is the draw feature? We'll let you draw, maybe. We'll 3
have a workshop on how to use Zoom. I put the blue dots. That's as far as I got. 4
5
Male: [Inaudible 2:33:08]. 6
7
Commissioner Peterson: Oh, okay. 8
9
Female: It's okay. 10
11
Commissioner Peterson: Woops. 12
13
Female: You can use words. 14
15
Commissioner Peterson: I can use words? 'Cause I don't know how to draw. Is there really no 16
draw? 17
18
Male: [Inaudible 2:33:28]. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Peterson: All right. Bottom left. Drawing icon. Let's try this one last time. 1
2
Commissioner Templeton: You guys have too much fun with it [inaudible 2:33:42]. 3
4
Commissioner Peterson: Whiteboard? No. 5
6
Commissioner Templeton: Sure. That's it. Yeah. 7
8
Commissioner Peterson: It's this – I have to stop the share if I put the whiteboard up. I don't 9
think you can draw. 10
11
Commissioner Templeton: Okay. 12
13
Commissioner Peterson: I've seen you do the draw on here or you did it once and ever since 14
then, I'm like, "I'm gonna learn how this works." 15
16
Commissioner Ji: [Inaudible 2:33:57]. We'll have a separate workshop [inaudible 2:33:59]. 17
18
Commissioner Peterson: Okay. So for the benefit of our architect here, maybe take a 19
screenshot of this. And so the reason why I put this here is if I start on San Antonio Road – and 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
then what I was gonna do is draw that. There's not a large neighborhood there but if you do 1
look and if I was able to draw, if you go down – is that – did – we said it's Ferne? 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: Mm-hm. 4
5
Commissioner Peterson: There is a walkway there, diagonally, in the corner of Ferne that goes 6
into Cubberley. 'Cause right now, you have to walk all the way down where the gas station is 7
and getting in around that corner where the gas station is, people – I mean, if you think people 8
were flying in and out of Middlefield, they're going even quicker to get their gas real quick and 9
you – it's a really awkward corner to walk through, so you really do wanna stay in that 10
neighborhood and it doesn't seem like a lot of extra walk to go down and around and come 11
around to the fields in the back but it's enough. But I think the idea here is this shows – I guess 12
it'd be a north-south kind of approach of going from San Antonio to Mitchell Park through 13
Cubberley as a walking. And most of the walking path looks like it's there. It's – in fact, I think it 14
all is there. Google won't show it but you can walk from San Antonio right now to Mitchell Park. 15
It shows here 23 minutes but it's actually about a 15-minute walk all the way through, if you 16
take the walking path. So I think that's one of the things that I don't see in your plan and that's 17
what I wanna give the feedback is that there is an existing walking corridor there that definitely 18
needs some attention but I think it's essentially – it's the community corridor that the flow 19
definitely follows a different route than if you're driving. And having been in that neighborhood 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
with the dance school and stuff like that, I do see people cutting through there all the time, so 1
that is my comment. I think the other commissioners have covered the other topics well but I 2
also do agree that the parking garage being all one side, that actually is probably an issue 3
because I – this is a place where people stop for an hour, where their kids run in, come back 4
out, and there isn't any place to sit. You end up just sitting in your car in the parking lot and 5
yeah. It's just a mass of kids at the end of each dance class coming out and jumping in the car 6
and going, so okay. Thank you. Appreciate it. 7
8
Chair Akin: Thank you. I have Commissioner Ji and then Vice Chair Chang. 9
10
Commissioner Ji: Do you mind pulling up the criteria again? All right. I think most of what I 11
wanna say has already been said by other commissioners but I'll just comment. I'm not 12
supportive of the large garage structure on the side and then in terms of the bike circulation, I 13
strongly agree with Commissioner Hechtman on the kind of wraparound. I – especially because 14
I went to Fairmeadow and I – we would've kind of walked through that little gate, the little 15
yellow path that goes right through that middle. I do not wanna be dodging people on my bike 16
while they're walking through the middle of Cubberley and especially because I don't live I 17
guess on the Montrose side but I heard from public comment that seems to be a very common 18
way to get there. And I think providing – talking about kind of desire paths, I can imagine that, 19
for example, that folks would wanna get from the Nelson side through the Montrose side and 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
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2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
they'd wanna kind of wrap around the outside and I think that is something that we should 1
think about supporting, so I wanna talk about that. And then – so in addition, the ped-, I don't 2
really think I have specific feedback on the pedestrian circulation. It seems fine. I think I'm more 3
worried about the – biking around is I think my recommendation there. 4
5
In terms of building scale and physical space organization, I won't – I may – I sound like a little 6
bit of a broken record. I think the usage is very important and I think something really easy like, 7
"Theater will take, I don't know, 1,000 square feet and whatever. A dance studio will take 1,000 8
square feet." And then just giving even people different options like, "This building is 2,000 9
square feet and it could be a dance studio and a yoga studio," or something like that, just 10
something really basic to allow folks to imagine what that would be like. And I think that also 11
applies to your outdoor space organization as well. So I've been swimming since I was three, 12
went to Gunn, been swimming since and one of the things that I really hated about swimming 13
at Gunn is that their locker room is very far away from the pool. You have to really wrap 14
around. It's very inconvenient. And so talking about outdoor – if we decide that the pool is an 15
ou-, applicable outdoor usage, I think that's an outdoor and indoor combined usage. It's very 16
hard to separate those two as concepts, so yeah, so I think that. And in addition, there could be 17
some tie, I don't know, like outdoor basketball is near the indoor basketball court or I'm not 18
sure exactly. I'll defer to your community services expertise on exactly what that looks like but I 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
think just having more use cases I think would really help with both the buil-, the physical space 1
organization and the green space organization as those two tie together. 2
3
In terms of building scale, I think fellow commissioners will know that I'm probably one of the 4
most sensitive about things like setbacks and daylight planes and I actually want to agree with 5
the fellow commissioners here that I actually don't really mind more height kind of in any of the 6
areas. As Commissioner Hechtman mentioned, Middlefield's a pretty large road and we're 7
already allowing, what, two or possibly 3-story buildings physically adjacent to single-family 8
housing. I think 100 plus feet away is an appropriate usage, especially if we make it kind of 9
interesting and make it kind of a community center point on that front side could be really 10
interesting. 11
12
In general, I'm still a little bit confused about the usage of promenade. I think Commissioner 13
Hechtman has highlighted some of the use cases on the front side, which could be interesting. 14
However, I do think that his commentary on the Concept 3 with the grand promenade, I really 15
think that that's just a little bit too narrow for anything really to be useful there and I guess I’m 16
a little bit indifferent about the front promenade. I guess it could be useful but in general, I 17
think something like 70 feet isn't really that – it's good enough for a walking path or getting to 18
and fro but I wouldn't really consider that as a primary use case for green space, let's say. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
And then in terms of being a good neighbor, I think that that really involves some creative 1
thinking about folks getting to and from. I really appreciate Commissioner Templeton and Vice 2
Chair Chang's comments on dropping off kids. I think that I could imagine lots of traffic. If 3
anyone's driven through Palo Alto during school time, there's lots of parents, lots of kids. I think 4
that being a good neighbor doesn't just mean managing congestion within Cubberley but on 5
the neighboring sites, so for example, at Gunn, right? Georgia Street is a very common 6
complaint from the neighbors because it's just a convenient place to drop off somebody, and so 7
thinking about making sure that access for transportation is pretty easy, such that neighbors 8
also don't feel adverse transit impacts is something top-of-mind for me as well as something 9
like the Charleston Center, I think just making sure that we don't see adverse effects on them 10
either. So those are I think all of my comments there. Yes. Thank you. 11
12
Chair Akin: Thank you. I have Vice Chair Chang and then Commissioner Templeton. 13
14
Vice Chair Chang: I too also really appreciate hearing from all the other commissioners and kind 15
of the big picture thinking. Everybody's brought of something that I haven't thought of, so 16
that's really great. Hopefully we've added some value for you guys tonight too. Most of my 17
comments are going to – I mean, the idea of being a good neighbor is what spurred my thinking 18
here. So one piece is that as – again, as we see on Google, we're actually really close to 19
Mountain View, and so I don't know how much coordination or visibility we have into what 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Mountain View is planning to do. I think that if we do this well, it's also gonna be a huge draw 1
for Mountain View because it's much closer – much, much closer to where a lot of their housing 2
is also going in. And so that's just – I don't – it's not a fully baked thought. I don't know what the 3
implications are but I think we're gonna see a lot more traffic from Mountain View. We have a 4
great Enjoy! catalog. We're gonna be serving Mountain View with that, so we need to think 5
about how to do that well and to manage it also. 6
7
Secondly, I was just over at the JCC and Moldaw today and they are two different organizations 8
kind of on one fused campus and because we're right next to PAUSD here – again, this is not a 9
fully baked thought but I think there's pretty big implications and I'm not sure that PAUSD fully 10
knows what they're going to be doing with their section of the site but thinking about how the 11
two – it might – does it make sense to have it kind of feel like one campus but two 12
organizations? Because there's a lot of cross-pollination that could theoretically happen. I 13
mean, there's adult education there right now as well, so that's another piece of being a good 14
neighbor and the interactions there that might be really important to think about and the JCC 15
and Moldaw do it really well. And I think – what did they talk about it as? A multi-generational 16
campus, I think, and I've heard that same word being used in the context of Cubberley, so I 17
think that there's parallels there that we could really think about and may make it semi-18
permeable and I could see that being really useful here too. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
And then in terms of transportation, I'm gonna bring in something on a different working group 1
that I was in. This is in Portola Valley for – Midpeninsula was – is opening up a new park there. 2
And what they did in partnership with the City of Portola Valley is they're routing some of the 3
bike traffic off of Alpine Road onto a little parcel of Midpen and using that as a friendlier bike 4
path for people who might want – not want to travel at such high speeds as they have on 5
Alpine. And so because Middlefield is gonna – it's already quite congested, as a number of 6
commissioners mentioned and it's only going to get more congested likely. There could be real 7
value in – this site is well situated in that it could make us – a large section of Middlefield much 8
more bike-friendly if we kind of drove the bike traffic into Cubberley, which is sort of what's 9
shown, I think, but I think that that's – some of the speakers were saying, "We don't want 10
people on Middlefield." I agree. Probably not on Middlefield. There's a really wide bike lane 11
there but it's pretty scary and then you – people have to navigate those pretty scary driveways 12
going in and out of the Charleston Center but this piece of land, we could have additional green 13
space, trees, or something there on the frontage and if you bring the – a bike path in, like a nice 14
bike path, that could make it much safer and so I don't know what the bike – like the BPTP folks 15
think of that but it could help with some of the connectivity in that part of Palo Alto. 16
17
And then finally, in terms of being a good neighbor, it sounds like there's – I mean, there's more 18
parking than there is right now, I think, but part of being a good neighbor is making sure that 19
our parking – so often in Palo Alto, any structure parking – any parking that people can't see 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
right away is not well utilized. And so as we think about that, how do we make sure that it's 1
well utilized so that we don't create problems for Charleston Center, problems for the 2
neighbors across the street, safety hazards if people park across the street and try to cross 3
Middlefield if there's actually really good parking there. And there's campuses like PAMF 4
Mountain View that does a pretty good job of utilizing their underground parking, Whole Foods 5
in Los Altos, so what do they do to make sure to drive people there? And also, as I was looking 6
at Google right now, next to the currently planned athletic fields, there is a giant parking lot, 7
right? And the – I don't know that we can count on that in the future, and so that's just 8
something to think about. And Commissioner Ji had mentioned – part of it is also to make sure 9
that there's not a ton of congestion going in and out of this property and if anybody's tried to 10
drive on Middlefield next to – when schools are getting in and out on – you – it's completely – I 11
think Challenger School is one of them as well as – I'm trying to think where else but there – it's 12
a nightmare. And so what we wouldn't want is if there's some big kind of open house event or a 13
chili cookoff equivalent, something that draws thousands and thousands of people, we don't 14
want it to be a standstill on Middlefield, which we know is a – already a challenge from much 15
smaller populations of organizations. 16
17
And then my final thing is not related to being a good neighbor but is re-, neighborhood related, 18
which is I really wanted to emphasize that point that Commissioner Ji made about considering – 19
okay. So Mitchell s-, Park is just sprawling green – literally green space and very, very close. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
When you look at the map, the distance from Mitchell Park to the Cubberley site is the same as 1
the distance of one end of the Cubberley site to the other Cubber-, other end, so it's actually 2
quite close and we probab-, we should think about whether we should – we should be, I think, 3
doing something different potentially than what Mitchell Park offers. So that's it. Thank you. 4
5
Chair Akin: Thank you. Commissioner Templeton. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: Thank you. What a good discussion we're having. I hope that our 8
consultants and staff are enjoying it as much as I am. I want to start before the – w-, before I 9
forget to tell you that I don't believe we have any 50-meter-long pools in Palo Alto. We have 10
one at Stanford and we have one at Foothill. I tell you that because it will draw people. Fifty by 11
twe-, 50 meters by 25 yards wide is a really good size for a pool. However, you may wish to 12
consult other swimming families for that, some great coaches and great teams in Palo Alto you 13
can talk to. Anyway, I want to echo Commissioners Hechtman and Chang about dipping the bike 14
path in from Middlefield. I would be satisfied if it was a sufficient land buffer between 15
Middlefield and the bike lanes, even if it doesn't go inside the buildings, so just to be flexible, 16
just to share that. These – retaining these buildings, these three buildings, can you remind me? 17
One's an administrative building, one's a theater, and one's what? 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
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2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Amanda Deml: Correct. The current renovated buildings being proposed is the pavilion, the I 1
Building, and the theater, and we can pull up the slide if you'd like. 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: No, no. It's fine. I'm... 4
5
Amanda Deml: Okay. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: I'm looking at it. I just wanted to – yeah. 8
9
Amanda Deml: Oh, and the uses. So inside the pavilion, it's a gym, so it's used for all sort of 10
activities as far as... 11
12
Commissioner Templeton: Okay. So you... 13
14
Amanda Deml: ...soccer... 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: It's... 17
18
Amanda Deml: ...basketball... 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
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Commissioner Templeton: ...not the s-... 1
2
Amanda Deml: ...volleyball. 3
4
Commissioner Templeton: ...it's not the stage. 5
6
Amanda Deml: The Cubberley Theater has a stage and... 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: No, no. 9
10
Amanda Deml: ...auditorium... 11
12
Commissioner Templeton: I'm talking... 13
14
Amanda Deml: ...seating. 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: ...the outdoor one. 17
18
Amanda Deml: The outdoor stage, so the grassy lawn and the outdoor... 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
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2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: Yep. 1
2
Amanda Deml: ...stage. 3
4
Commissioner Templeton: Just wanted to make... 5
6
Amanda Deml: The amphitheater. 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: ...sure I understand. So you mean the gym. It's called... 9
10
Amanda Deml: It's the... 11
12
Commissioner Templeton: ...the pavilion... 13
14
Amanda Deml: ...pavilion. 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: ...but you mean the gym. 17
18
Amanda Deml: Correct. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: Okay. None of these facilities are worth keeping and I don't – I have 1
no idea why we're even discussing it, so I'm gonna tell you that I have used two of the three of 2
these. I have not used the Administrative Building but I have waited outside of it during 3
Nutcracker rehearsal after Nutcracker rehearsal after Nutcracker rehearsal. I'm not impressed. I 4
do not think it is a building that needs to be kept. So why do I tell you that? Well, it's cute on 5
this map and it makes me think, "Oh, what if we had a space that was inviting and some 6
structure that was attractive?" I remember one time, I went out to a rally in Tracy at a park, a 7
nice, big open space and they had a little gazebo and we had a band and speakers and it was 8
fun. I mean, I get it that that's a space that we could use and it would be possibly a place for 9
shade, a place for an outdoor stage and some kind of community gatherings. I can imagine that 10
but I wouldn't imagine it – any of these three buildings. That – it's just totally not cool and it 11
wouldn't be in the spirit of making an improvement to the facility to keep that. So I would say 12
that the idea that's reflected in the picture, though, is having something that's a focal point, 13
something that's a gathering point. That's very attractive and I don't see that much on these 14
designs, right? We have these designs that are very rectangular. I'm – just because we haven't 15
talked about the geometry lately, I wanted to throw that out there. So – but we could do 16
something fun. We have something similar at Seale Park, for example. We have a colonnade 17
and wisteria growing up over it but it's back in the corner. It's not a focal point. It's not the 18
attraction. So if we're going to think about modifying our design such that the focal point is not 19
the center of the Middlefield space that is not even an entryway for vehicles, bikes, or 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
pedestrians, perhaps instead we could have our focal point be interior and a target of trying to 1
get people to gather there or have events there that would be fun for the community, if we did 2
keep that level of green space here instead of at Mitchell Park. 3
4
So the other thought I have is we absolutely must increase the height along Middlefield, 5
provided there's beauty and that – there's no reason we can't have both, right? We can have an 6
articulated façade that the architects work on with the ARB and we'll be happy as far as height 7
goes as long as we're not casting shadows or being ugly, like the back of a building kind of thing 8
along Middlefield. I think the neighbors would be appreciative. I think they would like seeing 9
something beautiful. Beauty can be any number of things. It can be trees p-, separating the bike 10
lane from the street. It can be climbing vines like they have down in Los Altos on the back of the 11
Safeway. Don't the back of the Safeway thing. Don't do it. There's all sorts of ways and 12
creativity that we can use to make that a beautiful place to drive past and an attractive place 13
that invites people in. So I would encourage us to do that. Would that allow us to have more 14
outdoor space? Yes. See my first comment about the pool. Okay. So arriving – arrival and 15
parking, we need to be – absolutely be able to access both sides of this. Assuming that 16
Middlefield is considered the front, I would want the left and right both to have some kind of 17
parking, not just the circle – I mean, the U shape. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Balance of building and green space. The very first thing that our consultant said tonight was 1
we have to use this space maximally and we are not going to get another chance to design this 2
for, I'm gonna guess, 75 years at least, so we have to be more aggressive in what we're gonna 3
offer. We need this space. We need places for our nonprofits and our small businesses that 4
provide afterschool programs and movement instruction and all sorts of things for our kids and 5
ourselves and even our elderly neighbors. And I wanna say we have talked a lot about being 6
neighborly to the immediate adjacent communities but we have an elderly community right 7
there at Middlefield and Charleston and I'm gonna guess we want them to be able to get there 8
and enjoy services at the new Cubberley. So we need to take their needs into consideration, 9
primarily access, right, and which I think is why you've got some drop-off points. But the more – 10
the safer we can make it for people that use their own energy to get to Cubberley, the better, 11
and that's why we wanna push the bike lane in a little bit. All right. I think that's it for me for 12
now. Thank you, everybody. 13
14
Chair Akin: All right. Last call for comments. Commissioner James. 15
16
Commissioner James: Oh. Sorry. I think my button's not working. I keep... 17
18
Chair Akin: Huh. 19
20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner James: ...tagging in and it doesn't work. 1
2
Chair Akin: Oh. 3
4
Commissioner James: Okay. I am going to probably sound terribly repetitive here but I'm gonna 5
try and frame this in a different way and I'm only gonna comment on what I have strong 6
feelings about. And I think – one thing I feel like I heard, I feel like I heard several 7
commissioners say, "We care about setbacks. Height matters but we think we g-," I didn't hear 8
anybody say, "We can't go up." I heard a number of people say, "I think we could go up. Maybe 9
that would give us more green space. Maybe there's some interesting tradeoffs we should look 10
at." I – so I think we need to consider that. I – and I think – I guess the point I wanna make in 11
terms of buildings is I think both – I sense this a little bit tonight among the commissioners and 12
in my – in reading some of the reporting from the last meeting, it seemed like a lot of people 13
kind of had a hard time making a choice and I think we're overlooking the fact is that be-, that's 14
because they're very similar. I mean, there is nothing here that is radically different. It's like, 15
"Well, okay, we're gonna put this much square footage over here and this much square footage 16
over here and this much square footage in this span. And in the next one, we're gonna kind of 17
do about the same but we're gonna – maybe we'll put them on an angle because this bike path 18
is here," or something. I – but I think that's – I think that's – I think these are profoundly similar 19
in the way it imagines and envisions this space and I think we're way to early to lock in on that. I 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
just think – I think we need – I think s-, we need some radical rethinking in terms of how we get 1
the square footage and how it's distributed on this beautiful piece of land and what the 2
aesthetic tr-, sort of payoff for that is. I want beautiful architecture. I want really functional 3
space. I love what Cubberley does. I think we've got an amazing opportunity to take that to a 4
level that actually is a part of Palo Alto's tradition. I'm the most recent one here and I came to 5
this town and I'm like, "This is an incredibly progressive town. Look at all the public amenities 6
here." And I want this to be the best spot. And there's some pretty great ones out there. So 7
that's all I have to say. 8
9
Chair Akin: Thank you. Commissioner Peterson. 10
11
Commissioner Peterson: Thank you. I didn't know that my comments on the pedestrian 12
through-put, the walk path, would be as interesting. I'm getting emails on that, so first time I 13
have become [popular 3:00:16]. So what I wanna bring up is if we could bring signage into this. 14
Apparently, there's multiple ways of getting, I found out, from the Caltrain Station to the site 15
and simply I demonstrated it that I'm pretty familiar with that part of Palo Alto and I had no 16
idea how to walk from the Caltrain Station to Cubberley, which indicates that there probably is 17
a need for signage. 'Cause when you stand at that Caltrain at San Antonio, there really is 18
nothing that says, "This way to Cubberley," and once you're at Cubberley, there's nothing that 19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
says, "Mitchell Park is over here." So I don't know how to wrap that into this project but I think 1
it definitely needs to include signage. Thank you. 2
3
Chair Akin: Thank you. Commissioner Templeton. 4
5
Commissioner Templeton: Thanks. I forgot to comment on some of the points that 6
Commissioner James brought up but I wanna, if I may, take the opportunity to paraphrase for 7
our consultants the important point that he was making. That line of thought is what our voters 8
is going to be thinking. It's really important for – in – we've had library measures fail. We have 9
had air conditioning in public buildings fail because we had not done a good enough job of 10
envisioning and sharing a vision with our voters, so if this project relies on votes to exist or to 11
continue, it's extremely important for us to share the vision of why we're asking for this. What 12
does the building mean? It doesn't mean it's a building. A building's never a building, right? A 13
building is what you're doing with it, right? What services you offer. Who you're bringing 14
together. How you're transforming the person's perspective on something or other. So we have 15
to understand that and I recognize that we're going to come back with a new iteration that 16
refines this. I understand how designing works. You have a rough draft and you iterate on it but 17
next time we get to see this – do we get to see it before Council does? Did – I don't think I saw 18
that on the chart. 19
20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Kristen O’Kane: We're still working through that. 1
2
Female: [We hope 3:02:45]... 3
4
Kristen O’Kane: I mean, it's a very aggressive schedule, so we're trying to fit a lot in, so we're 5
hoping we can do that. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: Well, one thing that our commission serves for is to help you 8
anticipate the kinds of reaction you're gonna get from the people who didn't show up to your 9
meeting because they contact all of us. I gotta tell you, we get a lot of input that perhaps you're 10
not receiving at the enthusiasm of the public meetings. So we try and synthesize that and help 11
give you the feedback in a way that will help you understand what is the needs of the voter to 12
con-, support this project going forward. And that's not in any – this is a bond issue. It's not a 13
political thing. It's just how do you help people understand why they should support the vision. 14
So to be really specific about if it does come back to [inaudible 3:03:45] I hope it does 'cause I 15
believe we've given you a lot of really positive, supportive, actionable feedback today. But if it 16
does come back to us, if you want us to decide where should the bike path go, we have to know 17
what's here to help anticipate whether that bike path is gonna meet the needs of people that 18
are going to go to those buildings. So it's great. It's a wonderful opportunity for us to give you 19
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
feedback this early but some of the decisions you're – or recommendations you're asking for 1
from us might need to – we might need to see the next iteration to do that. Thank you. 2
3
Chair Akin: Commissioner Ji. 4
5
Commissioner Ji: I want to echo what Commissioner Templeton just said. I think that this 6
commission in particular has a lot of expertise in some of the handling people movement and 7
buildings that we see at kind of the later stages in projects and I would love to see this come 8
back to us if possible. And I also wanna echo what Commissioner James had mentioned about 9
the radical reimagining. We've had a resident who wrote a piece [inaudible 3:04:54] online who 10
described this as kind of an illusion of choice, right? We – there are l-, in all of the different 11
designs, the square footage of the buildings and the square footage of the open space is the 12
same, right? And therefore, there's not very much comment you can really provide except, "Oh, 13
well, I wanna move this building over by 100 feet." And so I'd love to see both the use cases as 14
well as some of the other considerations in terms of maybe people want more green space. 15
People maybe want more building space. I know this has been brought up that this was 16
discussed in 2019 but I would've loved to see that in the packet, the description of the different 17
use cases that have been provided in terms of what people actually wanted and then they – the 18
amount that people wanted and how that tallied up to the amount of square footage we got 19
here, right? I think that if we're going to have to ask the voters to approve a bond measure, 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
we'd lo-, I'd love to see more kind of optio-, they can actually provide feedback as opposed to 1
this "illusion of choice" that we're hearing. 2
3
Chair Akin: All right. With that, I think we have given a great deal of feedback and we need to 4
let our consultants wrap things up now. So shall we conclude this item? 5
6
Female: [Inaudible 3:06:15]. 7
8
Chair Akin: Very well. [Inaudible 3:06:16]. 9
10
Amanda Deml: No other questions. Just thank you so much for all your feedback and your 11
comments and yes, we have lots to digest and yeah. We thank you for your feedback. 12
13
Chair Akin: Thank you. And congratulations on working on a project that everyone wants to see 14
succeed. All right. I suggest we take a break. It is now eight minutes to 9:00. Let's return at 9:00. 15
16
Action Items 17
Public Comment is permitted. Five (5) minutes per speaker. 18
19
3. Review and Submit the Planning and Transportation Commission 2025-26 Work Plan 20
to the City Council for Approval 21
22
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Chair Akin: We will now move on to Item 3, to review and submit the PTC 2025-26 work plan to 1
City Council for approval. Ms. Armer, could we have your presentation? 2
3
Jennifer Armer: Yes. Thank you. I'm – we've got the work plan that we can share on the screen. 4
Don't have any additional preservation – or presentation beyond that but I will point out a few 5
things about this Planning and Transportation Commission work plan for the coming year. This 6
is something that's requested, that the Planning and Transportation Commission consider and 7
make a recommendation so that Council can consider it in September. The first page here lays 8
out the role of the Planning and Transportation Commission and the work that we do and the 9
second page includes some of the prior year's accomplishments and then we run through the 10
eight project goals – projects and goals that the Planning and Transportation Commission is 11
expected to work on in particular over the coming year. This is not an exhaustive list. As you 12
saw on the previous page, there are quite a few things that are in the purview of the Planning 13
and Transportation Commission and so not listing it here doesn't mean it won't be something 14
that comes forward if Council requests an additional effort be considered and recommended by 15
Planning and Transportation Commission. 16
17
One thing to point out from your last year's eight goals and projects. There was one in regards 18
to the Safe Streets for All Plan and that was Number 1, which was removed, since it was just 19
completed, so a great accomplishment from last year. And then we added one more at the end, 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
proposing an additional one that has a specific [inaudible 3:17:16 specifically referencing code 1
updates beyond what we get f-, in terms of updates based on state law or comprehensive plan, 2
there are sometimes recommendations from Council for additional work. For example, the 3
wireless ordinance. While this is something that currently is unsourced – unresourced, it is still 4
an item that has been requested for future work, both by the Architectural Review Board and 5
by Planning and Transportation Commission if it involves code changes. So that concludes my 6
presentation but I'd be happy to go through the goals or just have the discussion proceed in 7
whatever way you wish, Chair. Thank you. 8
9
Chair Akin: Thank you. Shall we go through the usual format of clarifying questions and we'll – 10
this is eligible for public comment, although I don't know that we have any. So any... 11
12
Jennifer Armer: Correct. 13
14
Chair Akin: ...questions? Any questions for everyone? Well, I actually have two clarifying 15
questions but fortunately, you're well prepared for these. Do we anticipate any tasks this year 16
related to the Stanford General Use Permit? 17
18
Jennifer Armer: We do not. I did – per the question you shared with me, I did look into that. The 19
County would not proceed with that until they received an application from Stanford and they 20
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
have not received an application from Stanford at this point, so we would not anticipate that 1
during this fiscal year. 2
3
Chair Akin: Good. And then the second is of a similar type. Do we anticipate any tasks this year 4
related to grade separation? 5
6
Jennifer Armer: I am not aware of any. I think this i-, that would be one of those that if it got to 7
a point where it was ready for review by PTC, we would bring it to you regardless of whether it 8
was listed here. 9
10
Chair Akin: Very good. That's all I have. Anyone else with questions? No? Do we – Mr. Tavera, 11
do we have any public comment? 12
13
Samuel Tavera: Through the Chair, I've received no public comment cards and through Zoom, 14
I've received no raised hands or public comment requests. 15
16
Chair Akin: Thank you. Okay. Then we are open for general discussion. Commissioner 17
Hechtman. 18
19
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1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Hechtman: Thank you. Just a few brief comments. So in the prior year 1
accomplishments, the last bullet point is some work we did on what I think are quasi-judicial 2
activities, so three vesting tentative maps, a PC and a PHC. And so I was wondering why our 3
work plan doesn't include that we'll tackle these kinds of things as they're presented as a 4
Number 9. That was the first thing I noticed. And then a suggestion. In Project Goal Number 6, 5
updated bicycle and pedestrian transportation plan and increase – I think this should say safe 6
connectivity across the city because that's really the focus of it is – I mean, I can ride my bike 7
across the city. What we're trying to do is make it more safe. So I would suggest that that's 8
really the beneficial impact, I think, is enhance safety, so that's a suggestion. And then just 9
above the language Project Goal 6, under high priority, the second sentence I just didn't 10
understand. "Additionally, the public welcomes opportunities to engage with the PTC on this 11
topic." Isn't it that the PTC welcomes the opportunity for the public to engage with them? So 12
take a look at that sentence and see if maybe it could be reworded to be a little more clear. And 13
those are my comments. Thanks. 14
15
Chair Akin: Thank you. Vice Chair Chang. 16
17
Vice Chair Chang: Same placeholder comment that Commissioner Hechtman and Chair Akin had 18
mentioned in pre-meeting. And then I thought that – so if you look at the high priority, lower 19
priority, I think this is a template element in the Project Goal 7 and 8. I just think we should 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
change it to NA because we don't need to say anything if nothing needs to be said because it 1
just says, "Some of the program-," it's just self-evident statements and I think we just sound a 2
little silly there. In addition, I thought that for Project Goal 7, since this is something that 3
Council just had asked us to do, we should say this includes Streamside Corridor changes and 4
bird-friendly design – Streamside Corridor and bird-friendly design changes in Title 18 just 5
because that is something that we did work on in the past that we know needs to come back to 6
us and was requested by Council, so it kind of recognizes that they've asked us to do it. And 7
then finally, I think this comment came up last year when we were having the discussion about 8
how these are meant to just list some projects and goals in no particular order. They're no 9
prioritized in any way. I thought that so-, and so some – I don't know if there's – if we should be 10
explicit about that but this – these aren't numbered to indicate prioritization or I think 11
somebody had suggested if we just said A, B, C, D instead of 1, 2, 3, 4 that that might make it 12
seem less like a prioritization. Those are my comments. Thanks. 13
14
Chair Akin: Commissioner Peterson. 15
16
Commissioner Peterson: Thank you. So one of the goals that came to mind when I was watching 17
this – and this isn't a recommendation to modify here but I did wanna raise the question, which 18
is that over in Mountain View, they have an agreement with the building trades that they will 19
accept some of their high school graduates into the union apprenticeship program, which you 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
make – it's like $250,000 a year in your fifth year. Starts off at $50,000. By your fifth year, you're 1
at $250,000. That's without overtime. And after that, company trucks and whatever else they 2
give you. So their planning commission isn't as strong apparently as ours is, I don't know, what 3
they said. I – their words, not mine, [I guess 3:24:32]. So they said their – they brought up that 4
entire process of making the agreement with the building trades so that their high school 5
students get into the high wage jobs went straight to City Council but apparently because we 6
are so influential here in Palo Alto, it would be something that might even start here if we 7
looked at who is our work force, what is our work force pool. Do we want – like when – I forgot 8
his name already – from the Carpenters Union calls in and says, "Hey, please le-..." 9
10
Female: Rene. 11
12
Commissioner Peterson: Rene. Yes. When – the other one is [Eli Caldwell 3:25:07]. 13
14
Female: Yes. 15
16
Commissioner Peterson: And so when Rene ca-, and Eli call in and they say, "Hey, make sure 17
you use local labor," that's what they're saying. Use the high wage labor. Well, shouldn't that be 18
our high school graduates here? And I would say, well, do any high school graduates from Palo 19
Alto even go in the trades? And they do 'cause they end up at Stanford 'cause they're all paid 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
250 grand a year and apparently, they come get master degrees from Stanford and I meet them 1
and I hear all their stories about Paly High and stuff, so it's not a lot of students but we're not 2
talking about sending a lot. I mean, they're – a lot is like three for the building trades 'cause it's 3
a little bit of a slow turnover there, so I wanted to bring that up that if we wanted to start 4
rolling that process of making sure that when we approve projects that it's our students from 5
Palo Alto that end up on those projects wiring up the building or whatever, making those high 6
wages. 7
8
Chair Akin: Thank you. Did you have a concrete proposal you wanted to make to – for us to vote 9
to add to the work plan? 10
11
Commissioner Peterson: I could make a proposal that staff looks into that for the feasibility and 12
just comes back and gives us some information. I'll just kick it down the road a little bit. 13
14
Chair Akin: Okay. Ms. Armer. 15
16
Jennifer Armer: I could provide some additional information at this time. One would be just an 17
initial reaction that that is a bit beyond kind of the purview of the Planning and Transportation 18
Commission. However, we do have a program in our house – adopted Housing Element that is 19
about encouraging local hiring, that is connecting with local labor unions and apprenticeship 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
programs within the city, and so that is actually part of a document that the City has already 1
adopted that that is an effort that there is interest in supporting. So from a staff perspective, I 2
would not recommend it be included as part of the work plan but wanted to inform you that 3
that is actually an element of one of the planning documents we have. 4
5
Commissioner Peterson: That is an interesting question on the purview of the workforce as the 6
Planning Commission. It's a subtlety but is it really – it just flips over to Council? 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: Would you consider possibly looking into a study session about that 9
so we can have a... 10
11
Commissioner Peterson: Right. 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: ...depth of discussion that... 14
15
Commissioner Peterson: Council... 16
17
Commissioner Templeton: ...may... 18
19
Commissioner Peterson: ...would... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Templeton: ...not be... 2
3
Commissioner Peterson: ...appreciate it. 4
5
Commissioner Templeton: ...available at Council? 6
7
Commissioner Peterson: Yeah. 8
9
Jennifer Armer: It's the level of work that I would say would need to be directed by Council to 10
open up a topic like that. That is beyond the normal scope of the Planning and Transportation... 11
12
Commissioner Peterson: It would... 13
14
Jennifer Armer: ...Commission. 15
16
Commissioner Peterson: ...come back to your staff 'cause you're the only staff that has the 17
knowledge of the actual building. 18
19
Jennifer Armer: Which... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Peterson: They've... 2
3
Jennifer Armer: ...is why I'm not interested in encouraging adding it to the work plan... 4
5
Commissioner Peterson: Right. 6
7
Jennifer Armer: ...'cause I know we already have so much work that... 8
9
Commissioner Peterson: Yeah. 10
11
Jennifer Armer: ...I don't anticipate that being prioritized... 12
13
Commissioner Peterson: Oh. Got it. 14
15
Jennifer Armer: ...but wanted... 16
17
Commissioner Peterson: I understand... 18
19
Jennifer Armer: ...to make... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Peterson: ...that. 2
3
Jennifer Armer: ...sure that you understand that it is actually something that is already part of 4
the Housing Element implementation is some discussion of related topics. 5
6
Commissioner Peterson: Okay. Can we be kept updated on that as it moves along? 7
8
Jennifer Armer: The actual implementation program in that case is about providing information 9
on the website and encouraging applicants to consider it, so it doesn't go beyond that at this 10
time... 11
12
Commissioner Peterson: Yeah. 13
14
Jennifer Armer: ...but it could be in future planning documents. It could be [inaudible 3:28:44]. 15
16
Commissioner Peterson: On that one there, on the encouragement, it's more difficult to be 17
admitted to the building trades than Stanford University and it usually has a 3-year wait list, so 18
that's one of the concerns – 'cause I work with East Side – is they encourage all their students 19
to apply but then essentially nobody is ever admitted without the one-on-one agreement. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Jennifer Armer: Interesting. Thank you. 2
3
Chair Akin: Any further discussion? Commissioner Ji. 4
5
Commissioner Ji: Wait. Just to clarify Vice Chair Chang's comments, these project goals are or 6
are not intended to be a prioritization list, Ms. Armer? 7
8
Jennifer Armer: I would open that up for discussion [by 3:29:27]... 9
10
Commissioner Ji: Okay. 11
12
Jennifer Armer: ...the Planning and Transportation Commission. I – my understanding is that it 13
is not supposed to be a prioritization but you can discern from what is included that there are 14
certain projects that are included individually and then there are others that are part of a kind 15
of group or category and so by that, I would say that does show that there are certain efforts 16
that are given priority by being given their own project or goal. 17
18
Chair Akin: Any other comments? If not, I have a few. Okay. I'm going to reinforce a comment 19
made by Commissioner Hechtman that I think one of the important purposes of the work plan 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
is to document for other people and groups what the PTC does and therefore, things that we 1
spend a fair amount of time on should be documented in the work plan so that they 2
understand that's part of what we do and how our time gets allocated. So that includes 3
reviewing individual development projects in the other categories that Commissioner 4
Hechtman mentioned. I'd also include transportation projects, including traffic calming. We've 5
looked in the past year at shuttles, Micromobility. So I think it would be a good idea to have 6
separate goals in the work plan that document that kind of ongoing task and they don't seem to 7
fit perfectly into any of the goals that appear in the draft we have tonight, even though they are 8
mentioned in the mission statement. So my inclination would be to perhaps take a vote to see 9
whether the Commission supports adding goals that document those two classes of ongoing 10
tasks. So I'm... 11
12
Vice Chair Chang: Do you wanna... 13
14
Chair Akin: ...open to... 15
16
Vice Chair Chang: ...make a motion maybe? I mean, if we... 17
18
Chair Akin: [Inaudible 3:31:44]. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Vice Chair Chang: ...need it. Or do we need a motion or how does this work when it's our work 1
plan? 2
3
Jennifer Armer: I can jump in and provide an initial answer to that. What I would recommend 4
this evening is I've heard a list of modifications and I can read those, summarize them for you, 5
that could be made as a recommendation that this be continued, that those modifications be 6
made and brought back to you at your July 30th meeting for a formal recommendation to 7
Council at that time. So I would ask that we get a motion to make sure that we do have 8
consensus on the modifications that are under consideration. 9
10
Chair Akin: All right. So do we need two motions, one for a continuance and then one for the 11
agreement on the items to be considered at the continuance? 12
13
Jennifer Armer: I think I would recommend it be a motion to continue with the following 14
modifications. We'd list out those modifications. As I said, I'd be happy to help by describing 15
those and listing them out and then see if there is support for that. If that one does not pass, 16
then an alternate motion could be made to continue with a different list. 17
18
Chair Akin: Very good. All right. And then I sense Vice Chair Chang is interested in making a 19
motion but if not... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Vice Chair Chang: [Inaudible 3:33:07]. 2
3
Chair Akin: Oh. You have a comment. Please proceed. 4
5
Vice Chair Chang: No. I just wanted to add one more thought in terms of organizing these 6
projects and goals. If – nobody seemed to chime in with anything thinki-, any desire to make a 7
prioritized list but I wonder if sort of – in the interest of furthering sort of the communication to 8
not just the public but the Council of how we spend our time, we cou-, if we organize them sort 9
of – if there is any ranking, it's sort of like this is what we spend the bulk of our time on, right? 10
So I mean, my reaction to it is specifically because we have Retail Ordinance updates Number 1 11
and we're likely not gonna spend a tremendous amount of time on that this year. We gonna 12
spend – be spending all of our time doing these two kind of placeholder additional projects and 13
goals and that might be more valuable in terms of ranking them, so that's just a thought, if we 14
need to organize them in some way. So... 15
16
Chair Akin: Commissioner Templeton and then Commissioner Hechtman. 17
18
Commissioner Templeton: I would just wonder if it's a – is it our – is it to us to prioritize things? 19
I think our priorities come from Council, so I'm not sure that prioritize – it's... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Vice Chair Chang: Yeah. 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: I think that's what you're saying. 4
5
Vice Chair Chang: Exactly. There's no point coming up with a prioritization but if we're using this 6
as a communication document – because when I presented to Council last cycle. Just a second. 7
Okay. When I presented to Council last cycle, it didn't seem clear to me that Council understood 8
what all we've been seeing. And I mean, some Council members really understand it because 9
they came through here but not all of them seem to really understand and the feedback that 10
they gave me on certain things was kind of like, "Well, okay, sure, but I'm not sure what I'm 11
gonna do with that." So if – since a good chunk of our time is spent reviewing potential 12
developments, if we put that as one of our project goals, right, it's clear that those come to us 13
when they come to us. That's not prioritization. It's not really our choice but it is our purpose, 14
so I don't know, but not prioritization. 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: So you wanna add – I mean... 17
18
Vice Chair Chang: I think this is what both Commissioner Hechtman and Chair Akin were 19
suggesting to – the addition of two – what's the best word? Placehold – two goals. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Chair Akin: Two goals. 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: Core job versus special projects. 4
5
Vice Chair Chang: Correct. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: Okay. I mean, I – I'm a – I agree that it would be more representative 8
of what we do but I also feel like it's ridiculous. I – and not – that's not any shade on anyone 9
here but if we're gonna drive from here to Fresno, we do not have to list that we're going to get 10
the car checked out and make sure the belts are good, that it's gassed up, there's fluid in the 11
radiator, right? Those are just part of the job. If what you're saying is that you're hearing 12
feedback from the Council that they don't know what we're doing, I'd be concerned – that 13
doesn't concern me about what we're doing. That puts the concerns in other places. 14
15
Chair Akin: I wouldn't limit it to Council. I think this – there are other readers of this document, 16
including potential commissioners, who need to understand what it is that we do. 17
18
Commissioner Templeton: Perhaps they don't need to understand it by reading this document 19
only. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Chair Akin: If it helps. And I'm sorry I stepped [in 3:37:23]. 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: No, no, no. I just – I stand by my "it's ridiculous" comment and I 4
would not think we would need to make a change or continue. 5
6
Chair Akin: I'm sorry. I stepped in front of you, Commissioner Hechtman. 7
8
Commissioner Hechtman: No problem. Before I get to what I was gonna say, I just noticed at 9
the beginning of this document we just need to refresh the date, which is still listed as '24-'25. 10
Okay. And I would love for this not to have to take staff a lot of effort or bring it back and so 11
what I'm wondering is if we could just– for example, this notion that I had that – what about 12
quasi-judicial matters as they're presented, I was then thinking about, "Well, okay. If we make 13
that Project Goal Number 9, we've gotta fill in all these boxes," and wouldn't it be simpler if we 14
just at the bottom of the boxes add two sentences? The first one says that, "The numbering of 15
the above project goals does not reflect any priority among them." That's the first sentence. 16
17
Female: [Inaudible 3:38:29]. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Hechtman: Whatever. Yeah. And then the second sentence says, "In addition to 1
working on the above project and goals, the PTC anticipates that it will work on a variety of 2
other matters during the work year, including transportation issues, quasi-judicial discretionary 3
projects as they are presented" and... 4
5
Commissioner Templeton: Regular... 6
7
Commissioner Hechtman: ...anything... 8
9
Commissioner Templeton: ...ongoing... 10
11
Commissioner Hechtman: ...else. 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: ...responsibilities. 14
15
Commissioner Hechtman: Yeah. Yeah. Just more of a generic statement at the end that ties it 16
off. 17
18
Chair Akin: Yeah. I don't see much difference between that and adding Project Goal 9, regular 19
ongoing responsibilities. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Hechtman: So what would you put under... 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: Would you ever take... 4
5
Commissioner Hechtman: ...beneficial... 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: ...it off? 8
9
Commissioner Hechtman: What would you put under Beneficial Impacts, right? Because again, 10
if you're gonna make it a project goal, then we have eight boxes to fill in, right? So first, what 11
are the beneficial impacts? Well, it depends on what it is but whatever it is, it's goodbecause 12
that's why we're asked to deal with it. All right. Timeline. Well, it depends. I'm trying to avoid 13
having to answer those specific labels with something that we know that's coming but we don't 14
know what it is. 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: More than that, it can't – those responsibilities can't be removed. 17
Everything one through eight can be removed, reprioritized, changed, but our everyday 18
responsibilities are written into the City Charter, right? This is like... 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Chair Akin: Yeah. It... 1
2
Commissioner Templeton: ...has to be done. 3
4
Chair Akin: Yeah. It simply – that's not the purpose that I have in mind for adding it to the work 5
plan. The purpose is communication to other people rather than defining for our own use what 6
our duties are. 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: I – my feedback is not that we shouldn't communicate. My feedback 9
is I don't support this being the way of communicating that. I think adding it as an addendum or 10
having it in another document or somehow defining the roles and responsibilities of the 11
Planning Commission is important. I just don't know why it has to be on the list of priorities. 12
Thanks. 13
14
Chair Akin: Hm. Any other comments? Oh, wait. Commissioner Ji. 15
16
Commissioner Ji: I think as someone who recent – when I, before attending my first PTC 17
meeting, read through this document, I think – I guess to both side's points, I think there's not 18
that much difference, although I personally have a slight preference towards marking it as a 19
project/goal. In addressing Commissioner Hechtman's comments about what all the boxes are, 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
we can defer to Project Goal 5 on packet page 45 where all the boxes just say, "Ongoing, 1
ongoing, ongoing, continued engagement from public." So if – I guess it doesn't really matter 2
either way but I'm just saying that it should be pretty easy to just copy all those boxes and 3
throw it at the bottom. So relatively indifferent either way. 4
5
Chair Akin: Commissioner Templeton. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: Thank you. About the Commission is an excellent place to expand on 8
what the Commission does, if it's not project specific. Current commissioners does not use the 9
name that I go by. I'd really like that fixed on every location, including this document and how 10
I... 11
12
Jennifer Armer: [I'm sorry 3:42:12]. 13
14
Commissioner Templeton: ...appear on these desk monitors. And yeah. I – if Commissioner Ji's 15
point is some of these things shouldn't be goals, I'm happy to strike them. 16
17
Chair Akin: Commissioner Ji, was that the – was that your intent? 18
19
Commissioner Ji: That was not my intent. No. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Templeton: [Inaudible 3:42:39]. 2
3
Chair Akin: All right. Well, we need to move forward, so what I suggest we do is we make a 4
motion as – in roughly the same structure as Ms. Armer suggested and we see how the vote 5
goes and then we can – if that motion fails, then we proceed to an alternative. 6
7
Commissioner Templeton: May I ask a question? 8
9
Chair Akin: Certainly. 10
11
Commissioner Templeton: Has any of us referred to this document at all in the last year? 12
13
Vice Chair Chang: Unfortunately, the Chair has to make a presentation to Council about what 14
we do and fill some slides with... 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: Since... 17
18
Vice Chair Chang: ...information. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: But since then. I mean, I'm just asking, is it – do we understand the 1
use of this? 2
3
Vice Chair Chang: Yeah. I mean, but it's a communication document to Council and the public. 4
That's what it is. 5
6
Commissioner Templeton: And we still think Council needs to have a refresher on what we do? 7
8
Vice Chair Chang: Well, it's not so much that it's a refresher on what we do but we're supposed 9
to report on our projects and goals and if 90 percent of what we do isn't listed as a project and 10
goal, it makes it kind of awkward. It's a template. The point is that we – as you well know, we 11
are different... 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: [Inaudible 3:43:57]. 14
15
Vice Chair Chang: ...from other commissions and boards. We don't decide what we're – we 16
don't go, "Hm. What do we wanna do this year?" and then pick. Most of what we do comes 17
from somewhere else, so... 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: It would be really helpful to – one project I would add is to get some 1
statistics that we can show to Council when we're presenting this about how much time we 2
spend on things that aren't on the list. 3
4
Vice Chair Chang: Right. So what we find ourselves doing is there's often a template that 5
everybody's kind of forwardi-, following, all the commissions are following, right, and there's no 6
place for us to put that. We certainly can make an extra place, so this... 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: I think... 9
10
Vice Chair Chang: ...is a... 11
12
Commissioner Templeton: ...it... 13
14
Vice Chair Chang: ...way [inaudible 3:44:30]. 15
16
Commissioner Templeton: ...would be amazing to give Council feedback on this particular 17
template that has never been useful for us. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Vice Chair Chang: I think this is – I think Ms. Armer has mentioned that it's being reconsidered 1
or something this year. Is that right? 2
3
Jennifer Armer: There are some revisions to the handbook that includes this template. I do not 4
anticipate changes to the work plan formatting. I didn't see any revisions to that. It had to do 5
with other elements of that overall document. 6
7
Chair Akin: Commissioner Hechtman. 8
9
Commissioner Hechtman: Yeah. It seems like the Chair and I are in agreement that this 10
document needs to have some reference to this other work we do. Where we have kind of a 11
different vision is where that should go. Should it be a project goal or a blurb? Honestly, I don't 12
feel that strongly about it and if the Chair has a vision for how it could look as a project goal, I 13
will say that if the Chair will make a motion to express that vision, I'd be happy to second it and 14
we'll do it that way. 15
16
Chair Akin: All right. I'll attempt to do that but before I do so, any further comments [inaudible 17
3:46:00? Commissioner Templeton. 18
19
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Commissioner Templeton: Yeah. I have a question. Did you write this document? Is this the first 1
time you saw it? Were you able to get... 2
3
Chair Akin: [Inaudible 3:46:11]. 4
5
Commissioner Templeton: ...this feedback before it was presented to us? 6
7
Chair Akin: Yeah. Okay. You've asked multiple questions there. 8
9
Commissioner Templeton: They're all... 10
11
Chair Akin: I did... 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: ...driving to the same point though. 14
15
Chair Akin: ...I did not write this document. As far as I know, Ms. Armer wrote this document. 16
And yes... 17
18
Vice Chair Chang: Thank... 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Chair Akin: ...I... 1
2
Vice Chair Chang: ...you. 3
4
Commissioner Templeton: Yes. Thank... 5
6
Chair Akin: Yes. 7
8
Commissioner Templeton: ...you. 9
10
Chair Akin: Thank you. And yes, I have seen it because I saw it before the – and discussed it at 11
pre-meeting. 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: But they – there was no opportunity for you to give feedback before 14
it was included in the packet, basically. 15
16
Chair Akin: That's correct. 17
18
Commissioner Templeton: So that would be part of my feedback as well. If it's gonna be 19
something that the Chair has to represent to the Council, perhaps you should be involved and 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
be able to give feedback sooner. I don't know. 'Cause what's gonna happen is we're gonna have 1
to add this to the agenda at the next meeting and discuss it and it's not a great use of anybody's 2
time. Thank you. 3
4
Chair Akin: All right. So I think this is one of the rare cases where the Chair needs to make an 5
executive decision. I do think it's important that it be represented and as commissioner 6
Hechtman said, there are multiple ways to go about that and I'm certainly open to other ways if 7
the first approach doesn't make the grade. So I would move that we continue this item until 8
July 30th and – until the date certain, July 30th – and that we address the issues that we have 9
been discussing by adding a Project Goal 9 patterned on Project Goal 5 as suggested by 10
Commissioner Ji and that the substance of the goal should be ongoing quasi-judicial review of 11
development projects and transportation projects. We can add additional examples if we so 12
choose. So... 13
14
Vice Chair Chang: And I think there's a list of other small things that Assistant Director Armer 15
wanted to rattle off, right? 16
17
Jennifer Armer: If it would be helpful, I can list the other corrections – mod-, slight 18
modifications that I heard. One was to add the word "safe" into the beneficial impacts of Goal 19
6. Another was to modify the wording under the high priority section of Goal 5. Another – a 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
third that I saw or heard was changing the high priority/low priorities for Goal 7 and 8 to be NA, 1
adding to Goal 7 a specific mention of Streamside Corridor and bird-friendly design work. 2
3
Chair Akin: Correct. And Commissioner Templeton's name. 4
5
Jennifer Armer: And correcting Commissioner Templeton's name. 6
7
Vice Chair Chang: And the date. 8
9
Commissioner Ji: And the date. 10
11
Jennifer Armer: And the date. 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: Did this motion include a continuance or is that something... 14
15
Chair Akin: Yes. 16
17
Commissioner Templeton: ...staff can accommodate without having to have a motion? 18
19
Jennifer Armer: So... 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Templeton: Without having to have a continuance [inaudible 3:49:49]. 2
3
Jennifer Armer: I am comfortable moving forward in whatever way the Planning and 4
Transportation Commission wishes. If you can make a motion that is specific enough in terms of 5
creation of this new goal, then I think we could move forward with that as recommended to 6
Council. It also could be handled as a very quick item at your next meeting if the Planning and 7
Transportation Commission would rather see the actual language before forwarding that 8
recommendation. Staff is comfortable doing either. The existing motion does include a 9
continuance, so that would need to be modified if that was not the intent. 10
11
Chair Akin: All right. I think we should see the language just to verify... 12
13
Commissioner Templeton: I was gonna suggest an option for you that we could vote that you 14
see the language and we don't have to bring it back... 15
16
Chair Akin: Hm. Is that sufficient? 17
18
Commissioner Templeton: ...since you're the maker and we could all say we trust you and the 19
intent would be recorded in the minutes. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Jennifer Armer: I would defer to Mr. Yang if he had thoughts on it. However, I will share that 2
given sometimes we have ad hoc committees or – that do additional work after a final decision 3
is made, this could be similar advice from the Chair. But Mr. Yang, are you still on Zoom with 4
us? Do you have thoughts on this? 5
6
Albert Yang: Yeah. No. That's a – that would be a perfectly acceptable way to – for the 7
Commission to act. 8
9
Chair Akin: All right. That sounds like an approach. Commissioner Hechtman, does that sound 10
okay with – for you? 11
12
Commissioner Hechtman: Yeah. I haven't seconded yet. I was waiting for the whole motion to 13
get read... 14
15
Chair Akin: Right. 16
17
Commissioner Hechtman: ...but I think that was the last piece of it, and so I second the motion 18
as made by the Chair with the additional information augmented by our assistant director. 19
20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
Chair Akin: All right. So we will not be continuing, then, so you need another motion without 1
the continuance? 2
3
Jennifer Armer: No. You can modify – I will clarify for the record. What I have heard is that you 4
accepted the suggestion to modify your motion so that instead of continuance, it would be 5
recommending approval with final review by the Chair to confirm final language and that the 6
seconder has accepted, if you can both verbally confirm that, please. 7
8
Chair Akin: I confirm that interpretation. 9
10
Commissioner Hechtman: Yeah. That is the motion that I seconded. 11
12
Commissioner Templeton: Point of clarification here that the language that will be included is 13
what we discussed, so thank you. 14
15
Chair Akin: All right. Does that provide sufficient guidance? All right. So we need a vote. 16
17
Samuel Tavera: All right. Commissioner Hechtman? 18
19
Commissioner Hechtman: Yes. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner James? 2
3
Commissioner James: Yes. 4
5
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Ji? 6
7
Commissioner Ji: Yes. 8
9
Samuel Tavera: Chair Akin? 10
11
Chair Akin: Yes. 12
13
Samuel Tavera: Vice Chair Chang? 14
15
Vice Chair Chang: Yes. 16
17
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Peterson? 18
19
Commissioner Peterson: Yes. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Templeton? 2
3
Commissioner Templeton: Yes. 4
5
Samuel Tavera: Motion carries 7-0. 6
7
Chair Akin: Very good. That concludes this item. 8
9
Approval of Minutes 10
Public Comment is Permitted. Three (3) minutes per speaker. 11
12
4. Approval of Planning & Transportation Commission Draft Summary & Verbatim 13
Minutes of April 30, 2025 14
15
Chair Akin: So we move on now to Item 4, approval of the PTC draft summary and verbatim 16
minutes of April 30th, 2025. 17
18
Commissioner Hechtman: Move approval as revised. 19
20
Commissioner Ji: Second. 21
22
Chair Akin: Technically, we could have public comment on this, so I should ask. 23
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Samuel Tavera: [Inaudible 3:53:29]. 2
3
Chair Akin: Okay. Good. [Inaudible 3:53:35]. 4
5
Samuel Tavera: Ready to vote. 6
7
Chair Akin: Very good. No comment. Yes. Shall we proceed for – with the vote now? 8
9
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Templeton? 10
11
Commissioner Templeton: Yes. 12
13
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Peterson? 14
15
Commissioner Peterson: Yes. 16
17
Samuel Tavera: Vice Chair Chang? 18
19
Vice Chair Chang: Yes. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Samuel Tavera: Chair Akin? 2
3
Chair Akin: Yes. 4
5
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Ji? 6
7
Commissioner Ji: Yes. 8
9
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner James? 10
11
Commissioner James: Yes. 12
13
Samuel Tavera: Commissioner Hechtman? 14
15
Commissioner Hechtman: Yes. 16
17
Samuel Tavera: The motion carries 7-0. 18
19
Chair Akin: Thank you. 20
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Commissioner Questions, Comments or Announcements 2
Members of the public may not speak to the item(s). 3
4
Chair Akin: And now it's time for commissioner questions, comments, and announcements. 5
Does anyone have anything? I do briefly, so if no one else does, I'll be quick. Since the last time 6
we met, there's been a community workshop and an advisory group meeting for the Downtown 7
Housing Plan and I just wanted to give you a brief update on that. The community workshop 8
presentation is a good place to get an overview of what's going on if you're interested and 9
there is also a much more detailed assessment report. The easiest way to find it is just google 10
Palo Alto Downtown Housing Plan and that will land you on the right page. A quick summary is 11
that currently, very little housing development downtown is financially feasible. The main 12
problems are the economic conditions, competition from offices for the space, the small site 13
sizes, and parking. In the public comments, you can find an analysis from Ken Hayes that 14
touches on some things we might do to improve the situation and I recommend skimming that 15
if you haven't already. More on this will be coming from staff and the consultants in the next 16
few months. Commissioner Ji. 17
18
Commissioner Ji: Thank you, Chair. I'll be joining the San Antonio Road Area Plan. We'll have 19
our first meeting in August and I'll report back afterwards. 20
21
Chair Akin: Any other comments? If not, then we are adjourned. 22
_______________________
1. Spokespersons that are representing a group of five or more people who are identified as present at the meeting at
the time of the spokesperson’s presentation will be allowed up to ten (10) minutes at the discretion of the Chair, provided that
the non-speaking members agree not to speak individually.
2. The Chair may limit Oral Communications to 30 minutes for all combined speakers.
3. The Chair may reduce the allowed time to speak to three minutes to accommodate a larger number of speakers.
1
Adjournment 2
9:41 pm 3
4
/es 5