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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1976-03-01 City Council Summary MinutesCITY COUNCIL MINUTES Regular Meeting March 1, 1976 CITY or PF?LO /MO Iii PAGE Adjourned Meeting of February 23p 1976 7 3 1 Policy and Procedures Committee rscammndations re Old Police/Fire Building 7 3 1 Adjournment of Meeting of February 23, 1916 7 6 7 Regular Meeting of March 1, 1976 7 6 7 San Antonio Way - Demonstration Project 7 6 7 PAMRS Contract 7 6 8 Adjournment to Executive Session re Litigation 7 6 8 Minutes of : a.nuary 15, 1976 7 6 8 Minutes of January 19. 1976 7 6 8 Consent Calandar A4tictn Items Refuse Disposal Area: Award of Contract for Monitoring Wells 769 County Request is Revise "Sphere of Influence" Definitions 7 6 9 Finance and Publit Works Committee Recommendation €e Newspaper Racks 7 6 9 Pie and Public Works Committee Recommendation re Annual Financial Audit Management letter -7 7 0 Solid A ateMsn merit Flea for Santa Clare County 770 Adjournment 770 730($) 38/76 March 1, 1976 i 76 The City Council of the City of Palo Alto mat 4this date at 7:45 p.m. in a regular meeting with Mayor Norton presiding. Present: Beahre, Berwald, Carey, Clay, Norton, Sher, Witherspoon Absent: Comstock, Eyer1y Vice Mayor Clay, Chairman of the Policy and Procedures Committee, stated that this matter has taken up by the Committee on February 10, 1976, and that the minutes of that meeting would reflect the lengthy discussion on the subject. Vice Ptayor Clay read the Committee's recommendetion see follows: A. That there is a demonstrated need for a senior center, that it should be a multi -service center and that such a center should be located in the core of the downtown area; B. Thet the Council endorse the Old Police/Fire Building as the preferred location for the aeiior center, contingent upon the resolution of financial matters concerning the improvements to the site aixd that the question of financing be referred to the Finance axed Public iiorks Committee for consideration, together with a letter from the Senior Coordinating Council with their specific request.; and C. That if the report back from the Finance sod Public Works Committee as to the availability of funda'is less than thst requested by the Senicr Coordinating Council and if that Council determines it cannot raise than difference so as to complete the improvements, the Finance and Public Works Committee be asked to investigate as a financial alternative that the building be sold and the money set ,side. Mayor Marton asked if thin recommendation was intended to be a motion from the Policy and Procedures Committee. Vice Mayor Clay responded that it taaa not a motion at this time, that be merely shed to est forth the Palicg eed Procedureri 'Committee's 731 3/1/76 recommendation. Mayor Norton thought that it would be appropriate here for staff to summarize the reports Council received in the last few weeks on this subject. Carlson Bedvell, Director of Social and Community Services, steted that the item before Council this evening related not only to the recommendation of the Policy and Procedures Committee regarding diapositiou of the Old Police/Firs Building, but to the broader question of the: leaned and scope of development of a senior cautsr. As >esatiosisd, a report from the Senor Coordinating Council vas received, requesting that the City designate the Police/Firs Building for * senior center and that the City pay the cost of remodeling it for this purpose. At the same time, staff reports presented an overview of senior center issues, and suggested Council focus on the need fora center, the sewers' location, and questions regarding the operation of the center and, that before deciding on a specific site, it was important to have policy geideeiines regarding the CCity' a invol-event in the senior center. In addition, there have beer staff reports on general information regarding costs associated with the Police/Aire Building and comparing it to Squire House specif i-- celly, and a separate report exemsning the issues and alternative locations fora senior center. Ms. Bedwc11 noted that the subject of a senior center has been before the Council since the Task Force on Aing' R recommendations were received in May, 1975. At the same time, the city has bee testing a multi -service center on a limited basis in the downtown Library, A3 authorized by the Council since last summer. Their findings were that the concept and the operation have been very successful. Ms. Bedweli went on to say that in June, 1975, the City Council endorsed the concept of an essentially privately established, operated, ,mud funded senior organizatiou and entered into a contract with the Senior Coordinating Council, charging it with the task of developing a strong senior organization to accomplish a nutber of goals, including serving as a consultant to the City and the cp erditaating and initiating of services. Thus, they have come back with their request for the Police/Fire Building as one way of carrying out that charge and furthering ng the recommendations that CAM. from the Task Force on Aging. The. Policy and Procedures Committee arrived at the policy recommendation which Vice Mayor Clay read, end thus, those are the recommendation* before the Council tonight. Staff has suggested, in focusing on this: issue in their several reports, that it is important for the Council to designate the appropriate level of City participation in a Sauior Center, both: for a physical facility and for the operation of the center. That participation can range from nom -involvement of the City, or partial or share responsibility between the private and public sector, or perhaps total responsibility ou the part of the City. axe those decisions have been laid out, then the Police/Fire Building, or any other site, can be examined, base upon the guidelines the Council establishes for staff. She stated that there were representatives from the Senior Coordinating Council present this evening who were looking forward to discussing this issue. Clayton Brown, Director of Budget i Staff Services, indicated that there was also a report is Councils ers' packets last week id+tntifie as .;) ;1$S: 6e that describes various alternatives to the use of the Old. Police/ Firs Building for a senior center. The five altereativas briefly described in that report ewers 1) building - 7 3 2 3/1/76 7;34 a new facility on lend that would be purchased; 2) purchasing an existing building in the downtown area; 3 developing the fourth floor of the Civic Center; 4) leaning a store -front site somewhere in the downtown area; 5) leasing of a new facility which could he built somewhere in the downtown area. The report, Mr. Brown noted, was general in exploring these alternatives since the costs of each one of the alternatives would be dependent upon the size of the facility required, which would depend, in turn, upon the level of City involvement in senior activities which Council chose to pursue. Councilman Berwald asked for City Manager Sipel's recommendation on the future use of the 01d Police/Firs Building. George A. Sipel, City Manager, responded that et this paurticula: time, he did not have a recommendetion. He added, however, that before Council decides to utilise that building for a senior center, Council ought to consider what City's role is in providing a senior center, what the City's role would be vis-a-vis capital expenditures and operating expenditures; if Council wanted to play a part in either of those two, particularly in the capital expenditures, z variety of alternatives, i;icle ding eeee of the Old Police/Eire Building, ought to be explored. He thought there were some gccd reasons to utilize the building as a senior center; there were likewise some good reasons to utilize the building for other purposes or, perhaps, even to sell it. He said that question has not been gone into in any kind of depth. Councilman Berwsld risked if Mr. Sipel or Mr. Brown wanted to respond on the appropriateness of Council's making a decision on use of the Old Police/Fire Station tonight, in vies: of the pending budget discussions and in view of what Staff and Council have said about the City's rather tenuous financial situation, to put it delicately. Mr. Sipel thought that any kind of a decision to spend a Large want of money for any purpose, whether for seniors or anything else, at this paau tic'i3asr tines without having the draft budget in hand, would by very unwise, be that for capital or for operating purposes. Councilman &ervald asked Ma. Bethnal to repeat what she had said about the alternative ranges of City involvement. He understood the last part of the ranges, wbicb was full City involvement but asked her to explain the other extreme. Ms. Bedwell Wired that the opposite side of full City involvement would be no City involvement. An alttruative in the middle would be shared responsibility between the City and the private sector. Councilman bervald asked if the consultant role pertained to the Senior coordinating Council, end had the SCC been savaged by the; City as a coueeultent on these matters. Ms. Sedwell ezpleitod that ores of the services the Senior Coordinating Council provides, through City's cattract with thee, i* the general role of sevisine the City on setters nffectieg seniors. She thought that the term "consultant" had bey used to describe this role; although it wee not the same and, perhaps, amore advisory by definition. Councilwomen Witherspoon said that she had mr441 the motion in Committee and had used the term "multi -service canter," bsvi*g in mind e 733 3/1/76 73'3 .:enter that provided a number of services of different types. She thought that perhaps the correct terminology was a "multi- purpose center," and asked Mai. Steeples if ere would define the two. Ms. Diana Steeplee, Seniors Coordinator, said that s multi -service center is limited to services primary one-to-ont or small groups services geared to meet such needs as legal, tie, income, health, etc.; whereas, a multi -purpose center brings together a mix of recreation, education, nutrition, and other services. Corrected See Pg. 911 Councilwoman Witherspoon atatsd that that was the use she had in mind. Councilman Sher, referring to the Senior Coordinating Council's proposal, noted that the cost of renovation of the Old Police/Fire Building mentioned in Dr. Mitchell's letter is $970,000. That figure is quite high in comparing it with the figure previously talked about in connection with renovating the building for a different purpose, of commercial nature. Iliac recollection was that that figure wan under $500,000. Hr. Sipe1 believed it was $400,000-$425,000 including a fair mount of money for restaurant equipment. He said he could not, at the moment, reconcile the figures. He added that staff looked at the plans and coated them out, and that was something that they would have to do in this case. He commented that in general they were looking et something here at the top of the line in every way; he knew of no other way to dascri.be it. Whether those figures would hold up after cost estimators looked at theca, he did spot know. His guess, however, was that within a certain tolerance of per- haps 151, those figures probably would hold up. Coon ilman Sher's initial reaction was that the figure seemed high. In the Committee minutes of February 1O, 1976, he believed that Dr. Mitchell talked about that figure and eaid it could probably be done for less but that $970,000 was what it would take to renovate the building in a first --class way. Councilman Sher felt that was on* point needing clarification by Mr. Stroequist or whoever would be talking to Council later about the plan for renovating the building for a senior center. Another area of concern to Councilmen Sher was that the Senior Coordina- ting Councii'a proposal suggests costs of both providing the senior center, staffing it, and underwriting the programs in the years ahead should be shared by the City and the Se for Coordinating Council, through its own fund-raising activities. The suggestion is made that in the future, if the City could participate in providing the physical facility, the City would not have to budget or be called upon to underwrite the programs of the Senior Coordinating Council. la that regard, Councilman Sher requested guidance from staff on as tabulation provided to Councils abeers, skiing present City contributions to senior programs and else the proposed budget for nett year, in explain which of aloes items the City would not be called upen to feed. Os seemed, for sacempla, that Project Mobility has nothing to do with the current propeeal. He wondered, however, about the direct budget item for the Senior Coordinating Council of $43,000 this year, $57,336 proposed for next. He requested information on that and some of the other items. 734 3/1/76 7 44' Ms. Steeples was not sure that she could speak to the intent of the Senior Coordinating Council in making their proposal. It was her assumption, however, that their intent was related to the last three items on the list. She hoped the Senior Coordinating Council would get a copy of the list, if Council had no objection. Whether or not it was SCCts intent that City would no longer need to fund the present senior adult services, she could not say. She felt the SCC visurmiited City's continuing to support senior activities. She preferred that the Senior Coordinating Council speak for themseIves,_since this had not been discussed in any detail and since there were soars areas of ambiguity in the future role they see for the City and for the SCC. Councilman Sher understood that point, addieg that when both persona here from the Senior Coordinating Council addressed the Council, perhaps they could enlighten him. Councilman Sher asked about the extent of the desire of the. Board of Directors of the La Comida program to have that incorporated in the multi -purpose senior center, given some statements that Mrs. Cage had made before the Council recently. i.e felt the Sevier Coordinating Council contemplates that program as being included, but Councilman Sher was left with the impression that the initiative or impetus of that was not coming from La Comida, and that the present facility would still be available in the Church, although there were same constraints there. He hoped that question could be answered. Counciiman Sher noted that Vice Mayor Clay, a Chairman of the policy and Procedures Committee, did not move the Committee action which they had unanimously adopted. That suggested to hide that Vice Mayor Clay was not now in agreement with the recommendations and thus did not want to make a motion on behalf of the Committee.. Vice Mayor Clay said it was appropriate to explain his position so that embers of the audience and Council might address the utter. At one point in the policy and Procedures Committee mating, he offered a motion to dispose of the Old Police/Fire Building. At a future meeting, he gave the matter further thought. He referred to the letter in Councils a berm' packet this evening from Councilman Eyerly from Finance and Public Works Committee, giving his position on the likelihood of there being funds available. In view, generally, of the City's current financial position and the large nu her of current requests for funds to support variou* programs, it was Vice Mayor Clay's intent, if appropriate, to put a motion on the floor. Mayor Norton asked if this motion would be a new motion, differing from the Committee's recommendation. Vice Mayor Clay indicated this would be a away and different notiou. Mayor Morton felt that should not be put forward yet and that City Attorney should be aid whether Committee rec ti.ona, ass * matter of course, _ ought to be 'roved first; then any other nation thet would cluing* the recommendation would perhaps be in order. He said has had never run into the situation 735 3/1/76 where Chairman of the Committee does not choose to put the recommendation before the Council. Robert K. Booth, City Attorney, informed Mayor Norton that it certainly has been traditional, though he was not sure that it was absolutely required for the Chairman of a Committee to put the Committee's recommendation before they Council. Be said he supposed if there was no support it, the motion probably doss not have to be made, but it has been customary to "get the ball rolling" by putting the Ccnmeittee recommendation on the floor or asking someone to do it and then amending it as the Council deems appropriate. Mayor Norton preferred such a procedure, noting that it does not necessarily change the result but creams an orderly way is which to proceed, unless there is some indication from the majority of the Committee that this is not their recoen nde- tian. He had not heard that yet. MOTION: Vice Mayor Clay in behalf of the Policy and Procedures Committee moved the recommendation as follows: A. That there is a demonstrated need for a senior center, that it should be a multi -service center and that such a center should be located in the core of the downtown area; B. That the Council endorse the 01d Police/Fire Building as the preferred location for the senior center, contingent upon the resolution of financial matters concerning the improvements to the site and that the question of financing be referred to the Finance and Public Works Committee for consideration., together with a letter from the Senior Coordinating Council with their specific requests; and C. met if the report beck from the Finance and Public Works Committee 4a to the availability cf funds is lees that that requested by the Senior Coordinating Council and if thst Council determines it cannot raise the difference so ss to complete the improvements, the Fineece sand Public Works Committee be masked to investigate as a financial alternative that the building be sold and the gooney. set aside. Councilman Carey, reepondins to Councilman Sher's earlier questiomi, commented that one of the reasons for the $970,000 estimated cost of renovating the Old Police/Fire Building Le the fact that the Senior Coordinating Councilis proposing is ashy a ming to the building; so some of the cost is not renovation but new construction. That is the tang that would 736 3/1/76 house the dining facilities. With respect to the question of La Comida's willingness to move, he noted Mre. Gamage was not present but added that during the Policy and Procedures Committee meeting, he had detected that La Comida had not turned down the new location, but, rather, that it was an option they would be looking at. He did not detect a commitment by La Comida to move but felt there was an interested response. Addreaeiag himself to what may have appeared to be an unusual procedure here at the Council meeting, namely the awing of the `oar ittee recommendation, Councilman Carey explained that Vice Mayor Clay made a motion in Committee that the Police/Fire Building be sold with a facade easement and the proceeds be earmarked for seniors. That motion did not get a second, although Councilman Carey would have been tempted to second the motion, that being the direction in which he was somewhat drifting, and he felt some interest in that motion. However, he felt the: because of the financial aspects of the Senior Coordinating Council's request, it was not his own preroga- tive to make a iudgemeut, namely that City does not have roughly one mi1::lon dollars to renovate the Old Police/Fire Building. He suspected he knew the answer but felt it was more properly a question for those members of the Finance and Public Works Committee to answer: Whether they world choose to answer the question in a Committee meeting, or a discussion before the full_ Council will bring forth a full financial analysis, Councilman Carey did not know, adding maybe tonight would tell. But he felt that if it came down to a question of :'foes the City have a million dollars to spend?" that that was not a Policy and Procedures Committee question but a financial question,thus he did not want to make the motion without giving the Finance and Public Works Committee an opportunity to do address the question. Councilman Beahrs remarked that he knew the staff vas legs than enthusiastic about this prospect, which he could understand. As opposed to this, he noted that M . Sipel and Mr. Brown, on February 19, 1976, wrote the Council, discussing the location of the proposed senior center facility. Later, there was a memorandum sent in which staff discussed the possibility of leasing premises which would accommodate La Comi.da and the aenior center in more Heal circumstances than those the Council is now discussing, at rental rates which were comparatively modest -- something likes 50O a square foots Councilman Beahrs wondered whether these lease premixes are available or exist, or whether they are an idea. Se wanted to know if there was private capital to put up on a risk basis and idealise the senior canter, which was a thought somewhat conveyed by staff's memorandum. Clayten Brown, Director of Budget and Staff Services, responded that the discussion in tame report was general to the *stein that staff has not identifiesd a specific location. It depends on what sire facility is required. Obviously, a 5,000 square foot facility is not only easier to acquire and lease than one of 50,000 square feet, but cheaper as well. Following their preliminary investigations, staff des think there is e real possibility that a lease site could be obtained, depending upon the site. The seas bolds far the possibility of having a facility built to suit - one of some 5,000 to 9,000 or 10,000 square feet. 7 3 7 3/1/76 7. r Councilman Beahrs asked if this would be by risk capital. Mrr. Brown said this would be with a lease of an approximate two- to five-year term. Councilman Beahre said it was staff's opinion, then, that someone would build a facility, for this rental rate. )tr. Brown responded that staff had an indication that someone may be interested in doing that, but that staff had not entered into any negotiations or had any direct discussions at this point. Councilman Beahrs said that this, in otbeerwords, wee not a figment of imagination but something more solid. Mr. Brown said that that was right but it was by no mans a sure thing. Councilman Beahrs thought it was interesting that staff made those observations, becauee presumably, if this type of offer could be developed, it could have some attractions , especially when compared to what they are now discussing. Councilman Beahrs commented he would take this opportunity to be a "miserable" politician and say that the people get what they elect. Over the period of years he had wit: essod the electorate in action in Palo Alto, they have elected Councils which, according to quick tabulations which he could Justify, on five items have put down the drain $1,950,000 of solid cash. He added now was the day of reckoning. Vice Mayor Clay said at the appropriate time, he will move that the Old ro1ic e/ Fire Bu€1diog be sold, with a facade easement, and that the sale proceeds be earmarked for seniors programs, and that the matter of specifics of the proceeds of the allocation be referred to the Policy and Procedures Committee for its review. Mayor Norton indicated he would be calling upon the audience at this point but reminded Council that at 9:45 p.a., there would be au extended Executive Session involving eeerts who would be here at that time. Be simply wanted all to keep that schedule in wind as they proceeded with this subfect. Pr. Sidney P. IiitcLell, 1550 Waverhey Stmt, President of the Senior Coordinating Council, indicated he had a few remarks, following which S.C.C. , had a 3-D color exhibit to stow those present wheat they were talking about at the Police/Fire Building site, Tonight was the latest of a series of endeavors to organise senior activities in Palo Alto. It has been preceded by the study, by the Task Force, by tbe ail hoc committee, by an exuded Senior Coordinating Council, by many Staff reports, and, more recently, by the Semior Coordinating Council report to the City Council an the need for a ae nior center; the Policy seed Procedures Committee's resction to that, and two letters Dr. Mitchell has written, on this natter, to Council, dated February 4 and February 19, 1976. 04 noted that last week Mr. Goldsmiths reported that 500 man hour, of work went into the Rousing Corporation effort; Dr. Mitchell did not know the der of hours hie group had put 13$ 3/1/76 73) into their project thus far, but was sure it exceeded 500; he reminded Council a great deal of hard work, all voluntary, by many interested people, has gone into senior activities and particularly, the senior center. Dr. Mitchell commented he would like to try for agreement on some matters. He thought one point of agreement was the need for a senior center, pointing out that this has been a central theme all the way through all the discussions starting with the study, with people interviewed, the Task Force, ad hoc committee, everybody thinks the senior canter is needed. A look around the country will show that many cities are already putting in senior centers. The youth have been taken cars of well; the seniors now need some taking care of. Palo Alto has to have a senior center, too, he added. What would go on at the senior center is in the Coordinating Council's report to the City Council.. It proposes a multi -purpose senior center. In considering the space needed, 5,000 to 10,000 square feet is not going to be nearly enough to accommodate seniors' needs in a senicr center. Concerning La Cc ida, Dr. Mitchell referrred to Mrs. Caaa4aaage's letter to the SCC. Ile believed Council had copies of that letter, which indicated La Cosaida's desire to be in the senior center. La Coaida has approved that aisd would be quite happy to move in, and, of course, La Camida in the senior center makes for a much nicer arrangement and is much better for the seniors. Another point he felt could be commonly agreed upon was that the only feasible place for a senior center is the Old Police/Fire Bending. No other place has emerged as a suitable possibility. They do have the staff memorandum of February 26, 1976, but he saw nothing certain there. The seniors need around 15,000 to 18,000 square feet of space to get done what they want to do in in a good senior center with programs and activities for the seniors. Thus, 5,000 or 10,000 square feet is not enough. If the Old Police/Fire Building is sold, the seniors have nowhere to go. At that point they are out, and the whole procedure stops, forcing them to begin again from scratch. He noted they have no land. Dr. Mitchell thought agreement could be reached that the Senior Coordinating Counc i 1 is to be the umbrella orgsnirat loon for senior aet{vitiee; this has been pretty well stated and understood in all discussions to date, The Senior Coordinating Council would like and expects to rup the senior center. The SCC' hae the capacity and the k owehow to do so. Dr, Mitchell believed it was understood that the City of Palo Alto and the Senior Coordinating Council would each contribute something to the establishment of the senior center and its programs. :.'ow much each puts in remains to be sea, but although the SCC hopes to assume the 'e urdeen of the responsibility for ee niors, the Senior Coordinating Council recognizes that in the beginning, they need the City's help to get them started. SCC; s problem, as with the City, is: wtaare is all the mousy coming from? They intend to raise considerable money and have already started on .fund-raising activities. They think they can do it. Studies have not yet been completed an this *latter. Never, before muds money_ can be iaisd, they do used to know what it is for and have much. They must have some 1 3 9 3/1/76 commitment from the City on what the City is willing to do. In otherwords, to what extent does the City feel committed towards helping the seniors. The SCC has two requests: 1) the designation of the Old Police/Fire Building as a senior center for Palo Altans, which they hope will be given to them tonight by the Council; 2) the extent of the City's pacti.ci- pati.on in this endeavor. While he was sure this would have to go to other committees, he asked this be divided into two parts: designate the Old Police/Fire Building as a senior center, and then go from there with respect to the money. Dr. Mitchell stated that the SCC has every intentions, of being reasonable, and they welcome this or any other opportunity to discuss the matter. He conceded that they have asked a great deal of the City, but, in so doing, they have given the City the extent of the problem. Now there must come a time to decide who does what. He said that each has their area of responsibility, and he was confident these can be discharged in an sable way. Re felt it was necessary to divide up how much each takea on. Dr. Mitchell said that Mr, Walter Stromquist, architect, would elaborate on what SCC has in mind. Mr. Stromquist showed plans and a model of the building, accompanied by a slide presentation of the project. He commented that the plans do not represent a final solution for the senior center but represent an indication of how the various spaces at the Old Police/Fire Building may he used to satisfy the needs of the program that has been developed by the Senior Coordinating Council. He observed the spaces work well for almost all uses that have been intended, with the exception of finding a suitable ;dace for La Comida. He indicated that the program could be included within the building, but it does present a problem because it creates a shortage of total space. Commenting on Councilman Sheer's questions on costs, Mr. Strussequist remarked the question had also come up from the Senior Coordinating Council. He had responded in this way: he believed the City Council and staff were very concerned about preliminary budgets that turn out to be too Iou end create considerable problems for financing'and policy. If the renovation ie Jena by the City, it can be expected that its requirements end procedures would be somewhat more _ eepensive than could be done under private development. The reesAeation figures include, in addition to the general contractor's cost, overhead, profit, 20% markup for foes, tests, and inspections, including investigations, surveys, architectural and engineering services and laboratory and field inspection. In addition to this, a 15Z contingency factor hats been added, which is fairly standard for thie very preliminary budget purpose. Me indicated he had talked about this with Joe Anton of the Public Wotks Department and thought that ha was in agreeeant 'with the general pattern of the prsseatation. Commenting further on Dr. Mitchellas remarks on the staff report of February _26, Kr. Stromquist commented that nothing in all of theeprograms that ttavhe been developed by Senior_ Coordinating 740 3/1/76 Council indicated that 5,000-10,000 square feet'is at all adequate. His knowledge of other senior centers is such that a facility of that approximate size would very quickly prove to be inadequate and once so established, there would have been expenses involved that would be lost. An important part of this is the cost which makes the building suitable for the Senior Coordinating Council, and the activities et the senior center, Mr. Stromquist said his presentation had been brief and that he had discussed the program at the Policy and Procedures Committee meeting. He did want to express his thoughts that the Old Police/Fire Building lends itself very well to this purpose, and there has been no change in his opinion on this, after studying all of the various other alternatives, since a letter he wrote to Councilman Syron Sher on October 3, 1975. He noted there had been countless reports on the alternatives. He added that the Senior Coordinating Council does need to have an opportunity to start a fund --raising drive based on something that hae a real and significant background for decision. Councilmen Sher prefaced his questions by making clear his own position. He believed Mr. Stromquiot knew, having referred to their earlier correspondence, that he wants to see the Police/Fire Building saved for a public use and thinks the senior canter le the most appropriate public use that he can imagine. It has been his position from the beginning, added Councilmen Sher, and it was he who, at the time there was a recommead.ation from the Committee to sell the Police/Fire Statio71 last fall, asked that Council welt and see if the Senior Coordinating Council would want to consider the building for a senior center. That is still his position. He remarked that tonight there had been heard $ variety of expressions of present intent on the part of various Council members; what Councilman Sher was looking for tonight is a way to make it possible to preserve the building for this purpose. He reiterated that he t'sought it ought to be preserved for public use; it is a wonderful building, and a part of the heritage in Palo Alto. Theme his questions were not because be was trying to cut down all the SCC has tried to bring together in a proposal, but because be was looking for some formula to make the project possible. His first question concerned the $970,000, which included the new wing. Councilman Sher asked how much of that figure would be for the new wing. Mr. Stromquist responded that eppraximatee1y $200,000 was involved in the new addition. Cozen! lean Sher noted the second point Mr. Stromquist bed mentioned in his marks was the fact that La Co ida could be established initially in the present building; although it would put some squeeze on as far ss space. It was then suggested that there might be soma problem later about expanding the space, if and when the funds becomm available. Stromquist remarked be bad touched on that matter very briefly and appreciated the opportunity to expand on the idea, Their feeling is that the immediate addition of the nutritional - 7 4 1 3/1/76 programs area, called the dining room, is very important because it allows for the development of a well -protected, gunny area toward Ramona Street as a patio, with a southeast exposure, which means it gets protection from the. wind. It also means that the nutrition progrmu can go ahead; the area will provide not only a dining room, but will also provide a space for seating of about 250 people and be used for assembly purposeee. If that is built now, it adds greatly to the way in which the rest of the building can be used and avoids the problems.of later needing to find additional spec*, and that any satisfactory additions will create confusion and interruption of the established programs. Councilman Sher voiced agreement with that, suggesting at the same time as an alternative that if the funds a:eu't available from one source or another to go thu full distance at this time, in his view, it would be better to go as far as possible and get the building dedicated for this purpose than to have it be sold and used for some other vse. Councilman Sher was interested in the Senior Coordinating Council's proposal and What they vuld be locking to the City for, as far as future support was concerned. Dr. Mitchell responded that if the Senior Coordinating Council was as successful is raising motley as they hoped to be, they would carry the burden of the annual costs of running the senior center, cost of aerviceo, programs, etc. Thus, they do have intentions to raise enough money to do this. Councilman Sher said that, putting it in terms of the proposed budget for next year, the last three items were $57,336 for the Senior Coordinating Council; $16,000, bay Care; $:0,000, Rome Repair Maintenance; he asked if the Senior Coordinating Council would contemplate looking for support from the City for those particular program in the future, Duo Mitchell indicated City support would be requested only until they could cover these programs themselves. These programs would not be City Council budget items. Councilman Sher comeated that was the way he had understood SCC'a letter: to $1,200,000 the Senior Coordinating Council wee hoping to raise would be used to take care of those kinds of programs. Dr. Mitchel indicated that was correct and that they wed to get au endowment, if possible of $1 million, or more, to handle these program. He fait it would take more than that amount; but, until such time as they were established, they would have to rely upon the City for saw help. They would become independent of the City budget as rapidly as possible. Councilman Carey had questions on the cost of running the facility, he noted that in Committee he had enpreei.d the hunch that the cost of running the facility would be somewhere in excess of $50,000 a year. He has not yet heard anything specific about the annual operating cost. Assuming the Senior Coordinating Council would be running the senior center, Council- men Carey's undd*. standing woes that the coast of ramming the 743 3/1/16 center would be in addition to what is presently budgeted for the Senior Coordinating Council -- that it would be an extra cost. He requested a response to that assumption and also his assumption that the cost would be some $30,000 annually. Dr. Mitchell responded their txxpectations were that it would not covet $30,006 a year. He felt that figure be high, in his estimation, and said they did not have any final figures, commenting that presently they did not know where the senior center would be located and what they would have to provide for. He suggested that Mr. Wilson, who is working on the senior center, could help with this information. John Wilson, 2 Palo Alto Square, said he was a resident and Vice -Mayor of the City of Portola Valley, where he was faced -wvith similar budget problems, He is Chairman of the Site Committee. Essentially, he noted, their group was a creature of the City Council, and Mr. Wilson hoped the site of the Committee could keep up their enthusiasm to do something coward getting a senior program going, 'Mr. Wilson stated that he had heard Mrs. Gamage'e statement before the Policy and Procedures Committee with respect to the Ls Comida Program, and he understood her to say that they are pleased with their current location, but they see the senior population of Palo Alto growing, and the Task Force study does indicate that it is not only growing, but that seniors are becoming a higher percentage of the total population of the City. As the program grows and the nutritional program grows, La Comida is not going to be taken care of in the church facility because they have a limited amount of time available daily there. Basically, La Comida is going to have to go to two sittings. At a facility that would be provided in the senior center, they could have unlimited time and more than one sitting; whereas in the present facility, they could never get beyond the single serving sitting each day. With respect to the site, Mr. Wilson saw the Senior Coordi ting Council as having two functions: op a operaetionel, or operating senior programs; another one, frankli, is a money -raising function. He said it was their job to out and supplement the City funds with whatever they can to make a viable senior progrsa. Unless the Senior Coordinating Council gets a clear statement of enthusiasm and support from tbs City of Palo Alto, the SCC is like a group of handball players without a backboard - they can wave their arms around, but do not really have anything with which to operate. Essentially, their program is a etching program. They need capital and continuing funds, and the figures presented are based upon the fact that if the City puts up $1 million, the Senior Coordinating Council will go out and raise $1 million. He observed that was a great deal for a private group to undertake, but they thought it possible. If for some reams the City feels it cannot, or does not want to, commit to that, the SCC considers it extremely important that the City, at this point, tell the Senior Coordinating Council shat it can do so, that they ail. have their backboard and can start hitting the bell again. They must have a specific progrsn. The advantage of the Old Police/Vire Building is that it is a lovely building which exactly suits the needs that were set by the Task, fees ' rs, which aaid they need 15,E ware 763 3/1/76 feet and will need more and more space as time goes by. He pointed out that it gives them something to shoot for. Recognizing that the City needs to make studies of budget requirements and a determination of what the City can put into the program over what period of time, where the money will come from, etc., the Senior Coordinating Council does hope the City can continue to engender their enthusiasm by giving them something to shoot for. Councilman Beahrs asked Mr. Wilson if he could give some specifics on just what would be required with respect to a City commitment. He understood the need and the idea. However, he wondered if the Senior Coordinating Council had in mind the sale of the Old Police/Fire Building property and deeding of it to the SC; or their corporation, or waa it their view duet a longeterm lease at a nominal rental would be satisfactory to their needs and future fund raising. He caid this bad not yet been discussed. Mr. Wilson indicated that the Senior Coordinating Council was very flexible on the form the City's support could take. But in order to put something on the table, SCC suggested that the City maintain the building and lease it to them at a nominal rent for an extended period of time. SCC would operate the: center. Thus, the SCC would be raising funds primarily for furnishing the building -$700,000 -- plus operational, .zontinuing endowment and operational funds. He noted that it did not have to be that way; there could be other minds of arrangements, but that is the one the SCC put forward. Councilman Beahrs observed that it was too bad the Senior Coordinating Council people were not before the Council five or six years ago, when money was flowing through the hands of the Council like water. He suggested the Council then would have probably given them the building, plus the million dollars. Mr. Wilson said that the SCC was here to help. Councilman Beahrs said that unfortunately, the City needed a lot of help, noting they were paying for some of their errors and caMiSigiaati of peat yeeram. le thought it would be rather difficult to deed this property to the Senior Coordinating Council; and yet, if the shell 'could be made available to them, they were talking in magnitude very close to $1 million, considering the value of the building and the property, on a long-term lease. If such a commomitm nt war* made, Councilman Baahrs_thought this would be adequate to the SCC's needs if there were other donors. He thought this was a matter which required exploration before any final action vas taken. His feeling was that the best thine Council and comity could do, under currant constreints, web to sake the building, tw- ist, whereis, available to the Senior Coordinating Council oe3► a long -terra basis. Councilman Beahrs wondered, too, about -the 4X problems of their donors. Mx. Wilson thought there was no question about that. The Senior Coordinating Council has :'fe+n cleared by the Internal Revenue Service for their purposes. 744 3/1176 Councilman Beahrs asked even though the City should retain title, would this be so. Mr. Wilson stated that if anyone wanted to give money to the City, that is tax-deductible also. Councilman Seahrc wished that more people would do that. Councilman Carey recalled that Mr. Wilson had touched on something in Committee, which concerned him, and he wanted to repeat it here: that is, ghat basically -the Senior Coordinating Council ie asking is for the City to donate the land, the building, and roughly $1 million for capital improvements, and then the SCC would raise the money necessary to operate the senior center. Councilman Carty still does not have an answer to his question about what those operating costs are. His reason for wanting an answer is the rsason he stated in Policy and Procedures Committee; after donating $l.5pillion; cbnaidering the land, the building, and improvements, if the Senior Coordinating Council could not raise the money each year to operate the facility, he knew exactly what would happen, This Council, the City of Palo Alto, will make up the difference because he certainly could not throw the seniors out in the street after putting them in there, He said that he honestly could not do such a thing. He thus hoped that the Council would see a proposal the other way :around, where the City would be asked for so much a year to operate the center, but the SCC would indicate they could raise the $1 million to put in the capital improvements. Councilman Carey's question was if the Senior Coordinating Council had a commitment from the City that the land and the building would be made available to the seniors, whether it be on a nominal $1 -a -year lease, or whatever, could the SCC raise Si million, and in what time period, to put in the necessary improvements. Mr. Wilson could speak for himself, only, because the Senior Coordinating Council is some fifteen people, and when questions arise, everybody has a slightly different point of view. However, he could say that they have done the preliminary exploration of how to go about raising this money, and their advisors, professionals in themoney-raising field, tall them they can raise money either for endowment or for capital improve- ments._ Some donors like to give as room in they mess of a relative; some wo' id rather have an endowment for a day care program or a nutritional program, etc, In terms of fund raising, Mr. Wilson said if the City Council would give them a starter, the SCC would go after it. There are varied feelings among members on which would be the beet vay to go, but it is just this kind of matter they would like to discuss with the City's budget committee. Councilmen Carey's feeling, already stated, was that if the Senior Coordinating Council had cis in with their $1 million for capital improvoneate and were sue looking for the land, the butldittg, end soma annual commitment by the City, that would have nada more sense to him. Tha other gray around in- volves as tremendous commitment by the City, with an annual moral obligation after that. Ha wondered if in three months, 743 3/t/76 if" four months, oix months, or some other period of time, the Council indicated the building was theirs for a specific number of days conditional upon the SCC's raising $1 million for capital improvements, would that be something Mr. Wilson feels SCC can accomplish or would this be asking for something that cannot be done. Mr. Wilson responded there were those on the Senior Coordinating Council who advocate doing it all on their own; but when they think about, they feel it is an overly ambitious program, and they should ask the City for something very significant. However, he repeated that if SCC is given something in the way of a backboard to hit the ball against, they would start hitting. Councilman Berweld noted that the Senior Coordinating Council wanted the City to lease the building and take care of it. His wondered if that meant the City would maintain the building. Mr. Wilson responded that they had in mind they would do the normal janitorial type maintenance, but that the City would take ware of structural problems. Councilman Serwald asked how the SCC views the use of the pack; would it be viewed, more or less, as an exclusive senior citizens' park. Mr. Wilson's response was that the plan, as shown, indicates that there is an area towards Lytton Street, between the building and the pack, which could be utilized by the seniors exclusively. But, more importantly, at the rear of the building, there is southwesterly exposure which will make a beautiful, warm, outdoor patio for the seniors. The SCC envisages the seniors using this as their own area, and the park is primarily for background and setting. They do not intend to use the park except that they think it being there is a great plus. Councilman Berwald'a next question contented the parking tot and whether the Senior Coordinating Council had estimated bcw much parking space would be need by users of the senior center. Mr. Wilson stated no estimation had been discussed or considered. Councilman Sher indicated he would try out a suggestion to see if Mr. Wilson would consider it sufficient backboard on which to bounce the ball against. Suppose that tonight the Council were to endorse the Old Police/ Fire Building as the preferred location for the multi -purpose senior center, which was one of the recommendations of the Policy and Procedure Committee. Suppose, further, that the Council were to make a commitment tonight that the Old Po/ice/Fire Building would be leased to this Senior Coordinating Council osv a long-term lease for a nominal rental. but eubject to the condition that within six to twelve months, or whatever Hr. Wilson tells his will be necessary to raise tae $l,200, (Council Sher noted that the sees of $1million is constantly referred to. but he wanted to keep his eye an the $1.200,000 that than SCC suggested was feasible), to provide for the renovation necessary to mks the building usable for a senior center, and also to provide a fund for an ent, split in whatever steer necessary, depending on hove elaborate the renovation 746 3/1/76 . /' might be. The final step would be that should the Senior Coordinating Council be unable to raise the necessary funds by the end of that six to twelve months period, then the City Council, at that time, would determine what disposition should be made of the Old Police/Fire Building. Councilman Sher asked Mr. Wilson if that would be a aufficient tool with which to work, to help the SCC to go out and get their fund-raising drive under way. %r. Mitchell thought that axe the sort of commitment SCC wants. Getting back to the budget, he said they were really thinking about $100,000 a year, meaning they must raise $2 million, if possible, which would provide the funds to run the senior day care and all of the various prograaa. !f, in addition to that, they have to raise $1 million to fix the building up, they would then be talking about $3 million, which was getting quite high. Irr. Mitchell said he does not mind starting slow, but $3 million was considerable money for the Senior Coordinating Council to try to put tegether. Councilman Sher felt when talking about $3 million, they were talking about too much and would have to start short of that. He was pursuing the thought expressed by Councilman Carey: that perhaps they should think in terms of at least a substantial part of that first amount of motley to be put into the renovation of the building. Co'rncilmau Sher added that if he felt the pulse of this Council correctly, it would do no good to send this matter to the Finance and Public Works Cceaaittee with the request for $974#004, because it just is not there. Thus, he was looking for a way to move forward, make the necessary commitment tonight to get the fund-raising drive under way, and to see then what could be raised during that period and see how close the SCC can come; hopefully there would bo enough mosey, but Councilman Sher felt, quite frankly, that the $974,000 might have to be scaled down so that they do not start too elaborately yet would still have some left to put in en endowment fund to carry on some of the programs. He suggested SCC see where they are at the end of that period. Speaking for himself and not the Committee, Councilman Sher said that he might not rule out having the SCC come back at nut rear's budget time, if there were to be a twelve-montha' fund-rsit+ing period, if that's what it took, end take a look then to see if the Senior Coordinating Coil were somewhat short of the mount and whether the City weight contribute somewhat. He would not, however, wont to oak* a commitment at this time; he really did not think it would do any good.e at this time, in this budget year, to refer this mettsr to the Finance and Public Works Comeittee and try to solve the financial al problem at the outset. The east Councilman Sher wee reedy to do, and he detected that feeling in others, wee to sake the commitment tonight that the City Council is prepared to turn over this asset, which staff says if it includes the property between the building and Ana Street hasa value of itomething like $650,0 ► a substantial cootributioa on the City's part to lease it at a nominal rant on a long-term lease basis, and then see if that would not bo enougL to generate the funds to allow the Senior Coordinating Council to renovate the building and at least get started on endowment. That we what Councilman Sir wantsd to do tonight. 7 4 7 3/1/76 Dr. Mitchell responded that that was fair in his view; they would have to rely on the City, to some degree, for their annual budget to keep their programa going, and thus would have to come back on the City's budget for that. Councilman Sher said that he thought they understood that, at least in these initial years, the Senior Coordinating Council would be coming to the City Council, just as they are coming to Council for funds for next year. Of course, he added, that kind of request would have to be treated in the context of all of the other requests, and Councilman Sher said he Was sure the SCC would not expect their request to be handled in any other way. They would be carrying on a senior program to the extent that funds were available. Dr. Mitchell did not know whether he could commit the Senior Coordinating Council to that, but he thought it sounded fair enough. Be thought they should probably talk about it and come back to Council, but if this was the way the Council felt, he thought it was fair. Councilman Sher informed Mayor Norton that that was the motion he would make at the appropriate time. Councilwoman Witherspoon stated she would agree with what Councilman Sher said. She added that she could certainly understand the seniors love for the Old Police/Fire Building and that it is a perfect setting for the Senior Coordinating Council's proposed program. At the same time, she expressed concern, saying she thought it was quite clear to the SCC now -- that the City has not got any cash to put into this project right now. So all they had between them was the building, worth approximately $350,000, either the building itself, or the proceeds from its sale. Councilwoman Witherspoon was very concerned that the signals she was receiving was were the Senior Coordinating Council was so enamored of thia particular building that they were not being totally realistic about looking at thos=e aeeets. In otherworda, the point of the staff proposal on February 26, 1976, that the seniors look et alternative sites was, she thought, a signal from them, perhaps at Council's urging or on their own initiative, for the SCC to look sat how they could use those same assets and. still get more without committing the SCC hopelessly for financial fund raising in the community, or the Cecil, hopeless- ly, in using tax money. Councilwomen Witherspoon asked, irrespective of everything that is tentatively or completely proposed as an alternative, if the Senior Coordinating Council still wanted to stick with having that building end committing themselves to raising the money to fix it up. Dec. Mitchell responded that from what information he had from that staff sport, he would have to say they did, because there was nothing within that report that was adsquete for their needs. Councilwomen Witharopoon toted that SCC was projecting a need for 15,800 square feet and 18,000, if it includes the nutritional program. She did not think the a staff was mentioning anything 74$ 3/1/76 Corrected See pg. 911 Corrected See pg. 911 Corrected See pg. 911 more than 10,000 square feet. Site was not sure of the size of the fourth floor in City Hall, with regard to square footage. She also had no idea, since Council had not asked staff to provide this information, the size, for instance, of the Santa Clara County Senior Center. She added that it was a fairly active and large facility. Councilwoman Witherspoon pointed out that there were alternate ways of going, not that any of them were particularly just what they wanted, but then, she observed, they could not afford just what they want. Mt. 3rown indicated that the fourth floor is City Hall was about 0500 square feet. Diana Steeples, Seniors Coordinator, said that the Santa Clara County Senior Center utilizes 16,000 equsre feet. C-ouncil.womae Witherspoon commented thst the Senior Coordinating Council was talking about a facility of about the same size as the Santa Clara County Senior Center. Again, Councilwoman Witherspoon wanted to know if, irrespective of other alternative uses of their mutual assets, the SCC still felt they would rather commit to trying to do something with the Old Police/Fire Building. Dr. Mitchell felt they would. He remarked that they would try to do a good job, and they kzww that the City would like to see them do a good ,ob. He said that their proposal covers what they thought was the minimum mount of space needed in order for them to do a good job. La Comida is interested in being there, and it adds something to their program. Councilman Carey suggested in the Policy and Procedures Committee t} -at $50,000 a year might be the figure, and Dr. Mitchell had stated tonight that he thought that was too high. However, a few minutes ago, Dr. Mitchell had said the annual cost would be $100,000 a year. He asked if that figure indluded other programs. Dr. Mitchell said that he was mistaken when he said that $50,000 was too high and was sorry about that. He said that they needed $100,000 a year to run all of the programs they want to have. Council n Carey -asked if day care would be one of the programs. He wondered if there were any programs now being funded by the City that woad be included in there, therefore making the net cost leas. Bt. Mitchell did not think so. - Coe ci.laan Carey concluded that $CC's estimate, then, for the ,Canal operating costs, would be $100,000 a year. He commented he could understand SCC's concern if this Council told them they could drays the building if they could reiss the $1 million and then also raise $100, 000 each year after that. He pointed out that if the City is to maks a financial commitment, he would rather it be $1.00,000 a ;roar than $1 million and a long-term 16843; because his feeling is that if SCC was not able to raise the $100,000 a year, the City old bave to pay it. 7 4 4 3/1/76 John A. Snow, 105 Lowell Avenue, recalled that when he moved here, every facility Palo Alto had was rather Spartan, including City Hall, Police Department, libraries, etc. Over the yeaars, Palo Alto built some of the nicest facilities that any city iaa the world has - libraries, Community Centers, Civic Center, etc. - and the citizens have paid for theeec He indicated that he had never complained about additional taxes for school facilities or any other facility iu Palo Alto, including those for bird watchers, an intoxication center, or others, because ha felt that if there was a need for such program, he should support them. Mr. Snow observed that there had been a lot of arguing here tonight, adding that these senior citizens of Palo Alto have paid for everything along the way, He aekd if, in their twilight years, the City wee going to tell them that "the well is dry." He did not think the City should do this. He thought the Old Police/Fire building was an ideal location for the senior citizeua in every way and that the toss they planned to make of it was ideal. He could think of no better place. He hoped the City Council would do something about this building before it wax necessary to put a plastic roof over it and wait for something to be done. Mrs. Edna Sherman, 840 Warren Way, aafl.d that due to the illness of the president of the American Association of Retired Persona of Palo Alto, she was asked to speak in her stead and wished to reaffirm the statement made before the Policy and Procedures Committee. That was that the Board of the AJFP unanimously endorsed the need for a multi -purpose senior center and were strongly in favor of using the Police/Fire Building. The AARP hopes the members of the City Council are conscious of the contributions which the seniors have made over the years and will be sensitive to the needs of a multi -purpose senior center for the seniors' use. ?rank Manfredi, 219 Addison Avenue, thought the type of socialism the senior citizens want was appropriate for a future date when there wan true socialism, but he deplored using tax money for this purpose. He indicated he would support the City giving them the building, but that he thought they ahould take care of it themselves, inside and out, He wanted to see a center where young people could gd in and teach the senior citizens manual training. He suggested a fieaeiarket type operation at the rear of the building where seniors could raise money. bk. Manfredi coated that, personally, he would like to see the City CoUnc1l _ buy the "QueenMary" and place it near belt Moon Bey, where he and other senior citizens could go fishing. Mrs. Ethel Anderson, 360 Colorado Avenue, requested that, inasmuch as she was not able to rem, someone at the table before he would read her statement. bk. Sipel read her statement. "Offensive, insulting, threatening, insolent, slanderous, and obscene end boisterous tremerks are prohibited in the City Council Chambers." lira. Anderson cited that she wondered eometimes if Mr. Manfredi is au emeeption to this rule. She ludic -sited that she 730 3/1/76 attended Council meetings almost every week and hears his shenanigans of what is wrong with the Council; what is wrong with everything else. She wondered why he came to the meet- ings or why he even stays at the rasetiags. She remarked that some of the citizens who attend Council meetings think that there are tines when he should be stopped. Mayor Norton said he did not know how he could reconcile the matter end did not want to intermediate the dialogue. He noted that when be first ran for City Council, Mr. Manfredi van also on the slate and aIveya spoke up. He said that it has been that way since and it doss not bother him that much. Vice Mayor Clay commented that he was still at the same point that he was prior to Council's bearing from the audience and listening to the comsat. of Councilsembsrs. He would ask the question: if you have $354,000 in cash, in hand, or a shell, with the objective to raise another $3 million, which would you rather h.av He would think that the fund-raising efforts would be enhanced by bevies R oommiteent from the City to support programs, as opposed to having a shell for which the first million dollars must be raised to put into a building. As he mentioned at the Policy and Procedures Committee meeting, that first million dollars still doesn't get the program. Vice Mayor Clay bad great reservations about second --guessing the professional fund raisers, but it would appear to him to be that way and that $350,000, if in fat that is what the building is worth, is not a bad starting point. He remembered Council groping, when they were considering the last lessee .for the Old Police/rise building, and he had personally had a difficult tip arriving at a decision to approve that lease. It turned out, he added, that that decision was a mistake. Vice Mayor Clay felt that, as tough as this decision vas to make, he was inclined to believe that if they held out hope that there would be something forr t co.ing wherein this building would form its base, again. the City would be marking a mistake. This otter wee referred to the Policy and Procedures Committee in 4r.cober, 1975, end that referral vas for the purpose of having the seniors respond ,o the City with a proposal for renovating and using the 4lde Policy/Fire buildup,. Nov the seniors have come back vitb a program for which there is not enough money casing from the City to slake that progr= and building a reality for the seniors. To extend this for another six mouths, or whatever the length of time sight be, Vice Mayor Clay felt void be doings disservice to the seniors. If they have the $350,000 or $500,000 sash -des commented he did not know exactly vbat the building is worth --they could than !Ue well on their way toward dovoloping a program for seniors, instead of having a building shell end being at least a year off before beginning to do something. SUBSTITUTE MOTION: Vice Mayor Clay need, seco! d+ed by Carey, that the 014 Police/Tire Bulletin be sold with a facade essement, and that tbs sale proceed* be earmarked for seniors proves s; and that the matter of specifics of allocation of tha preceede be referred to the Policy and Procedures Committee fat heir review. 731 3/1/76 Couzciliaan Sher indicated he wanted to speak as strongly as he could against this motion. Vice Mayor Clay had said that the $350,000, if that was what the building would bring, would be a starting point for a fund-raising drive. Councilman Sher said that even if all of those funds were turned over to the Senior Coordinating Council for the senior center, they would simply have to go out and spend that amount of money, and a great deal more, in Councilman Sher's opinicn, to acquire a site in the core of the dovntowo area for the senior center; and to construct on the site, even a shell of a building com- parable to the Old Police/Fire Station as it now stands, which in and of itself has eignificant value, even though renovation is required. He did not view this as being a step forward for the fund-raising drive but, indeed, a step backward. Councilman Sher stated he thought Councilman Eyerly's position was the same as the view he expressed earlier about Council going on record as favoring the Old Police/ Fire facility as the preferred site for the senior canter and making the commitment to lease it on a long-term basis at a nominal rent, subject to the Senior Coordinating Council's raising the necessary funds for renovation. Councilman Sher noted that Councilmen Eyerly had given the Council a letter indicating that was his view. Councilman Comstock, who also could not be here this evening, gave Council a letter too, indicating that he seems to favor the position taken in the Policy and Procedures Committee, and he is a member of that Committee which took that action Thus, Councilman Sher did not think that either of those two absent members of the Council would support the substitute motion just made. Councilman Sher assumed that Vic;e '_Mayor Clay's motion was a substitute for the Committee's recommendation and suggested that perhaps the Clay motion should be voted on; otherwise, if it were appropriate, he would move his own as a substitute. If, however, there was a substitute motion on the floor, that motion should probably be disposed of, and if it failed, Councilman Sher would ask to be recognized. Mayor Norton indicated that would probably be the procedure. In the interim, several Councilmesbera bad expressed the desire to be heard from. Councilman Carey explained why he seconded Vice Mayor Clay's motion, stating that in his thinking, there weirs only two alternatives. One is to sell the Old Poiicel?ire Building; the second is to keep it or the seniors. But in either of those two choices, it was very clear to his as it was in Policy and Procedures Committee, that then City simply does not have $1,000,000 to $1,500,000 to provide to the Senior Coordinating Cecil to renovate that building, with the edditio ai exposure of an annual operating cost which now proves to be in the neighborhood of $100,000. He .said he knew what was going to happesa if gifts from the public were relied upon to provide the $100, a -year operating costs. The incentive to donate the mousy ard the inc4aetive to raise it would not be the ease as the incentive to raise money for the improvemente to the building, should it be mode available. He strongly suspected that the City would be providing swine between $50,000 to $100,000 a year to operate the center. 752 3/1/76 Councilman Carey said that he has known Mr. Manfredi for a number of years. He does not recall having agreed with anything Mr. Manfredi has said before, but he certainly agreed with him tonight. He agreed with what Mr. Manfredi had said abort the approach so far with regard to the Old Police/Fire Station. He personally thought it was unrealistic and that other alternatives have been overlooked or discarded; he pointed cut that he had intimated that in the Policy and Procedures Committee. Obvioual.y this was the best site; obviously no other site was batter located or had the square footage of the Old Police/ Fire Station. But it elan represented a substantial capital asset of the City. Thus, in considering the cost of the program, Councilman Carey said that he, at .crest, had to add that into the cost. If the City gives, is effect, a $300,000 to $500®000 piece of real estate to the seniors, eve:a though not cash, it is a cost, and he noted the Committee had gone through that exercise: it would be costing that amount of money whether it is dollars or assets. Then, the City is asked to add another $900,000 to $1,000,000 on top of it. As committed as he is to programs for seniors and programs for children, Councilman Carey said he could not see any hope for that kind of a financial commitment by the City. Therefore, the alternative, said Councilman Carey, is to sell that building and, as Vice Mayor Clay proposed, earmark those funds for the seniors program in the downtown area. The Committee has already said that the center ought to be in the downtown area. That amount of seed money may well provide some viable alternatives. As Mr. Sipal and one or two Council members had pointed out, there is a vacant floor in the Civic Center Building, and that is one possible alternative. He could think of others. If Vice Mayor Clay's motion fails, it seemed to Counnilman Carey that the other alternative the Council should explore is to commit the Old Police/Fire Building and the land, and he would raise the question of the parking lot, if it cows up, fora limited period of time so that the Senior Coordinating Council can attempt to raise the necessary capital to improve the building for its use. Councilman Carey remarked that he had some problem with -the latter alternative because ha did not see, at least so fair, a great deal of enthusiasms for that approach. Council ' Berwald had questions regarding how Council hoe arrived at this evening's point. He added that Carleen kdwell, Director of Social and Commueity Services, had tame kind enough to give him a copy of the Report of the Palo Alto Tusk Force on Aging made in April, 1975, entitled "When We Grow Older in Palo Alto," a very comprehensive report. Councilman Berweld noticed that on pp. 2gr.29,the report covers the proposed seaior center and talks about a 15, 0 square - foot building, 34,000 square feet of parking, 12,000 square feet of landscaping -_ a total site of 61,000 square feet - or for a two=-story wilding, lower numbers. It recommends the senior center be operated by the proposed tax-exempt orgsniza- ttoa, etc., and says ". . .funds requested from the City, $25,t . ." and then a gift of land, with no amount spa ified. There is also reference to the program's being launched at the earliest possible ace -stet to raise $2 million 753 3/1/76 from community sources, including both public and private, for construction of the center, with the City of Palo Alto committing land now owned by City, or acquiring and holding title to property for the site for the center. At that time, Councilman Berwald noted, $25,000 in funds from the City, plus the gift of land, and he wondered how they had gotten from that point to where they were now, as far as the gift of land, renovations, gift of the building, etc. Mr. Wilann responded that in the report of the Task Force it was indicated $2 million would be raised. Msesectially what the Senior Coordinating Council is doing it pursuing the recommendation of the Teak Force. SCC assumes a good senior program is wanted; the ass=ume, as the Task Force found, that this requires a 15,000--square-foot building, which exists in the Old Police/Fire Building; they assume that it is going to coat about $2 million, plus the public land. He called attention to the fact that the report refers to $2 million from the public and private sector. Eaeentially, that is what the Senior Coordinating Council has suggested to the Council; the City put in $1 million and the private sector put in $1 million and get this project going: Mr. Wilson said that in their view, SCC's reccsmcendetiun is in line with the Task Force report. Councilman Berwald asked then, if funds requested from the City should read not $25,000, but something else. Mr, Wilson stated that $25,000 was funds necessary to get the program going, and, in fact, the City budgeted $40,000 which is what they are operating on now. SCC is seeking an executive director and getting their programs string,. $25,000 was just the money to raise the money, he emphasized. Mr. Wilson commented that the SCC'a fund-raising effort would be easier, in his belief, if they had the commitment of the building, plus some sort of a commitment for future help, rather than if they had $350,000 cash. Be felt these two options were relatively equivalent, believing the valuation of the building to be somewhere in the neighborhood of $350,000. If the Council is asking the Senior Coordinating Council whether they would like to have the building cr $350,000, Mr. Wilson caked Council to please give the SCC a "shot" at the building first. He felt that it would really help their fund --raising efforts. Councilman Barwald asked if they would rather have just the budding and nothing Glee. Mr. Wilson said that they would like to have what they ean get - he would put it that way. He acid that if the Council vents to mak* the Senior Coordinating Council r d decision for chop, sell the building for tom, and give them the money, they _ wild like opportunity to talk with Council about that. They could tie a bigger contribution by having the building rather than the money. He thought those two were a trade-off, In the Std; D report to Council, Mr. Wilson observed that they bad studiead . alternatives. One of these was the possibility of using a City -owned tit* called the downtown north park property et Everett, Hawthorne, toad Kipling. .They studied 734 3/1/76 that possibility to see if they could do better by starting from scratch. The conclusion was that it would cost considerably more. Their view is that the hoped -for alternative would be neither as inexpensive nor as effective as the Old Police/Fire Building. Councilman Berwald remarked that he did not know what he was going to do with the notion now on the floor. He guessed it reverted back to something he had said earlier that he was going to have some trouble supporting either the motion which would be coming from Councilman Sher, or the motion made by Vice Mayor Clay. Citing reasons, Councilman Berwald felt that the Council did riot have enough information. They do not know exactly what it will cost to maintain the building. Councilman-Berwald said he has not decided whether he wants to pay for a senior citizen facility that is given gratis to a number of associa- tions, which collect dues from their members and which operate outside of Palo Alto. Perhaps there were some modest rentals which would be charged for these people whose names appear in an earlier proposal by the Senior Coordinating Council, but he said he would like to know that. He wanted to know hew much parking would be required. He wanted to have :more exect costs en renovation and the additional wing. He further wanted to know more about the ability of the Senior Coordinating Council to raise funds. He was mindful of the Squire House, noting that, with all good intention; the Council had gotten themselves out on a limb on Squire House, end may be getting that way on the Veterans Building, according to Hr. Sipel. He added that the Webster block has been laying there, denying the City interest for years, and as Councilman Beahrs said, the City dropped money on the drug program, and on and on. Councilman Berwald thought the Council should be not only compassionate and sensitive, but prudent as well. Stating he did know what the City's ability to participate vas, he pointed out that they have not yet gone through the 1976-77 budget. He did not know what the comparative costs were between the Old Police/Fire Building and others. Mr. Sipel makes a pretty good case for renting other space, but the SCC indicates that would not be enough space. Council- woman Witherspoon has mentioned space in the Civic Center Building. The future needs of La Comilla are not known. The Council, does not know the future deeds on City funds. It appears from a letter in packets this evening for Council - members that the city will be asked for $2,€x00 a year for La Cosida subsidies. Looking at the earlier Task Force report he had just cited, the total, without the $1 million, without the Old Police/Fire Building, etc., emountato $106,000 a year. He wanted to know how those amounts related to the note of March 2 from sirs. Steeples. Councilman Berweld said that he has talked to aos'e senior citizens woo do not believe that a monolithic senior citizens' center is the air. He said that he did root know but guessed that be was not sold on that yet, He mentioned the point was brought out tonight about the obligation of the City to provide this, at leant at this cost, so he felt that -there vas a great deal of responsibility on his part and on the 7 5 S 3/1/76 i part of all to be compassionate to requests but also to analyze needs and examine alternatives. The objective of just getting senior citizens in one place and under one roof may be desirable; Councilman Berwald thought it was and was not speaking against it, per se. He commented that there is some possibility that some of the people who are out helping seniors might become perhaps a bit bureaucratic. They want some offices in the building and may not be out as much as they should be. He felt a lot more facts had to be examined before the Council makes a decision or a commitment, to be realistic, within the City's means, to be prudent, patient, responsible, and not do what is maybe politically expedient, or simply rely on their emotions and desires to help senior citizens. He said that John SUo+s had asked if they were going to tell the seniors, in their twilight years, that the well is dry. Addreeeing Mr. Snow, Councilman Berwald did not know if the well wee dry or not, not only for senior citizens, but for a lot of other people. The well, he added, is going thy in many cities around the Bay Area, and he suggested the Council has an obligation to the seniors, not to be hypocritical and to raise false hopes that the City will be able to help. He felt it would be in the seniors' interest that the Council wait and not make a commitment until they get past this budget year. During the budget, and toward the end of the budget would be the time to look at this project: but not now. Finally, he; was not sure that he would want to take the final step of doing away with the building. Councilman Berwald thought that he would lean toward.; perhaps providing the building at least, all finances being, equal, but certainly not to dispose of the Old Police/Fire Building, pending the Council's budget sessions. Mayor Norton, before recognizing the next Council nember, reminded Council that to ten minutes, he had hoped they could adjoure for about one hour to Executive Session, and it did not appear that they would meet this schedule. He was also aware that there was a group here concerning Item #7 on the agenda and that it might be quite late before they get to the matter. Councilman Beaters thought that the City has talked rather blithely about feeade easements and sales guaranteeing the preservation of buildings; in talking about a structure such as the Old Police/Fire building, he could not believe that with all of the restrictions and qualifications that this Council and this community will throw et any developer, he will have much more luck than others have had. As far as Councilman beahrs wee concerted, in considering the inflationary effect and the depreciation of money, he would. far rather have a building and a piece of real estate in band than he would $350,000 if, indeed, that can be gotten for the Old Police/Fire Building. He said he would not pay $350,000 for that property for what this Council and this City would per*it hire to use it for. So he felt that once again, they were dreaming. Councilmen bashes voiced agreeoeent with Mr. Manfredi on taxes, but be would certainly not say that they were bui.ldieg, or ali.vvleg to be built, a country club for affluent elderly people in this community. He said there are literally hundreds of elderly people not represented this evening in the audience 7 5 6 3/1/76 /S6 but who are represented by people who are out to help them. Their chief desire is to get some commitment from the City, and Councilman Beahrs said he is the first to say that this City, after all of its profligacy, cannot put up hundreds of thousands of dollars in support of any program, and that goes for drug abuse and a few others that are still under contention. Councilman Beahrs said he was also somewhat amused at putting senior citizens in the Old Police/Fire building, because years ago, before it was built, he personally had recommended that this monolithic structure across the street, costing $400,000, be put on the top floor of the civic center building. At that time, the hue and cry on the part of several Council cambers was that the seniors were afraid of elevators. Now tha poaaibi- lity is raised of putting an elevator in this building where there are not enough elevators to serve the people. He remarked that he has a long memory, adding it hurts sometimes. Councilman Beahrs indicated he would support the motion Councilman Sher was about to make. He thought that is the beet this Council can do, and that is to make the Old Police/Fire building available for a definite period of time, and if it does not pare out, the City still own the building. He said that as things stand today, and the way the City has thrown money away in the past, he could not see Council putting any money into an operating budget for seniors - that was out of the cards. Mayor Norton agreed that this was indeed a tough problem and that there was no more meritorious cause than the one before Council tonight. But he dirt not think ttie City could afford to approve the Senior Coordinating Councils proposal, as presented, for the following reasons. First, in the broad sense, the City does net have the dollars it had three or five years ago when they were so generously funding various social programa. Mayor Norton thought that there might be a misapprehension, on the part of the con muuity, that the City Council is ready to dole out one or two million dollars to every worthy cause that comes in. Mayor Norton was persuaded, as he hoped the people were persuaded, that they simply cannot do this any longer. He cited the dreg program and the child care program, to name just two examples. Both, in their presentations which were quite appealing and very sim#.liar to those being heard tonight, included the promise that the City would only start the programs up for a year or two; the Boards then would go out and raise the funds to keep the program going. In the case of the drug program, the City s et $500,000, and not one cent came from privates sources. That program, to Mayor Norton's wind, was a failure; be thought they did not get anything out of it, let alone one-half million dollars. The current child care program is going better; it is costing the City $200,000 a year. They, too, promised that they would bring in substantial outside money; they have gotten County Berney, but Mayor' Norton was not aware they have gotten any significant private, if any private, may. Here, again, the City it on the hook for, as it stands now, $200,000 for that program. Neyor :Norton said that they could not continua at tbst level and he thought they were going to have to back off. 757 3//75 He referred to the Staff Report, indicating the City ie< already spending $200,000 a year on senior programs, without regard to a senior center. In the projected budget for next year, this sum for these senior programs is $234,000. This, he emphaeaised, is for senior programs without looking at another $1,000,000 plus an annual building commitment. Looking at the present proposal for the Old Police/Dire Building, Mayor Norton pointed out that the seniors were asking for the use of as $350,000 building; they are asking for an additional $900,000 of City funds to improve it, at the outset. There ins been discussion tonight that perhaps that $900,000 could be raised privately, then the proposal would be more inter- esting. Mayor Norton submitted that either way, the City is still in an awkward situation If than City gave this building, plus the $900000 to put it in livable condition, as air. Stromquist has indicated on his very nice plan is Councilman Carey said, no City Council would have the courage to evict the seniors ID the event that they did not perform on their promise to pay the monthly or the annual tab fcr maintenance. it is unrealistic, and the result certainly would be that, the City would not wish to evict the seniors. That bothered him, almost as much as if that $900,000 were privately rained and spent to make improvements in a building, and then a so-called default were made and the City were asked to pick up the annual operating costs. The City would be equally pressed to terminate the program, whether that was City money or was privately raised money and devoted to that purpose. Mayor Norton explained that it was, therefore, this area that really concerns him with Councilman Sher's idea, because he is asking, in effect, that the City go on faith this private money will be raised, just as the City went on faith in the drug care and child care programs. It leaves Council in a position where, if those good faith promises are not perforeed, the City is left in a very difficult position of having to pick up the tab which he was not sure they could afford to ao. He hastened to say that it we not a matter of distrusting the assurances that are made tonight at all; it is a question of good business and the City Council's being careful about not getting into another Squire House situation, or drug program, or something where they get themselves inextricably into a bad position. He had, he said, indicated on his notes, what he had in mind and was willing to do and would not reiterate it at the meeent. He indicated he would like some answer by Councilman Sher that if the Council goes the route he has suggested, and if the saeurencss that are mode here tonight, for one reasot or another, fell, and if private money to the extent of $1,000,000 ex $:1:200,000 is put into the ®Id Police/Fire Building, the imprevements wads, and then nothing, further is done, is Councilman Sher wi .liug to undertake the annual operating costs to keep the. program alive, Councilmen Sher responded that be hoped that the privets money would not only be sufficient to renovate the building at some Level, but also to get started on ei e& domm nt for senior programs es the Senior Coordinating Council wishes to, do. £part from that, if the money is raised and the building is renovated and leased on as Long --tom basis for a senior centers then he thought, as be seated earlier, that senior propane 734 3/1/76 would be carried ore there to the extent that there was money available to carry them on. As Mayor Norton himself pointed out, the City ie already budgeting $200,000 for senior programs, and Councilman Sher supposed that would be money that- would continue to be requested for that same purpose. To the extent money was available, and in competition with other programs, Councilman Sher said they would have to look at the request from year to year. However, he would still favor going forward and dedicating this building on a long-term lease basis for the senior center if the funds can be raised by the Senior Coordinating Council to renovate the building for that purpose. Mayor Norton remarked that the problem with the $200,000 is that very few programs would be duplicated in the building. He cited the Operation Homebound, which is for libraries, etc., for $1,000 and Project Mobility, projected at $94,000 for next year -- those programs would not be saved, as it were, by a senior program that is in the senior center. So it is $200,000 over and above, as he sees it, and if the Council chops off any of these other senior programs, giving :preference to a senior center, Mayor Norton suggested the Council would be hearing from a lot more people than were being heard from tonight. People in wheelchairs would be here, for example, if the Council tried to chop the Mobility Program in favor of funding the operating budget of the senior center. He indicated they were talking about $300,000-$400,000 a year when all of the items are added up. Councilman Sher noted he did not want those words put in his mouth about chopping out the Project Mobility. Mayor Norton said he did not intend to do that, but wee merely hypothesizing. Councilman Sher stated that there is, in the proposed budget for the coming year, $57,336 for the Senior Coordinating Council. That amount ie being requested; it hasn't been budgeted yet, but it seed to Councilman Sher it could be used for their programs end, to the extent it was there, they would stretch it as far as they could. He thought, and was hopeful, that other a niee could be raised to start this endowment they wish to mien. He hoped, if they coved forward on the basis of Councilman Sher's suggestion, the Senior Coordinating Council would decide to try to raise the $1, 200,000, or whatever amount, to renovate the building on perhaps a lesser scale than $970,000, and to start an endowment fund, perhaps $600,000 in the building and $600, 000 in endowment fund. if they were saceiess f ul . He would be prepared to give thee a year to see how such they cold ' raise, sling it clear that those funda would have to be used for the renovation of the building sod, hopefully, - there would else be some funds to start this endowment for the Senior Coordinating Council's progra , Councilman Carey found himself in the peculier position of being about ready to cast a vote which, perhaps, some will interpret as being against the seniors programs. Nothing, he added, could be further from the truth. He noted he had supported Council actions in 1975 and this year, that now equal some $200,000 a year in funds for. dots. Be was 759 3/1/7f prepared to support another $350,000 for a senior center in the downtown area because he thinks the downtown area needs one and should have one, and of money to get one. He was million facility paid for by he would vote for that amount not prepared to vote for a $1,.5 the City. In analysing this, Councilman Carey called for the Council to think about the other issues before them in a year, a year after, end the year after that, where fiscal problems will continue to grow. For example, he asked what they were going to do with Greer Park, which was coning up; what were they going to do with the Veterans Building, coming up. If the seniors have a $1.5 million facility downtown, the veterans will be in neat month and will want the same thing. Both requests have merit; both requests involve need by people. The Council ea* to respond to that, but he thought they must do so in a sensible way. Be observed that there had been no response from SCC to the possible utilization of the fourth floor of the Civic Center Building, and said that perhaps that will come Councilman Carey was concerned about the role of La Conida in the Old Police/ Fire Building, because that presently is a federally funded programs, and past history tells hire the federally funded programs have a tray of no longer being funded. Thus if the City prov3.3es a physical facility for such a pro- gram, they must think also that they may have to pay for it; indeed, at the present time, only 110 meals a day are furnished by the federal government, and yet before the Council is a proposal for a dieing facility to take 200 people. He said if they pay for the facility, they ought to fill it up, and that rases the question of who pays for the other 90 meals. He knew the a .newer to that. Mayor Horton stated he was voting against the motion but was not sure that he would vote for Councilman Sher's proposed motion. He did not think that this was an either/or proposition. The substitute motion failed on the following vote: AYES: Carey, Clay NOBS! Beahr'e, Berwald, Norton, Sher, Witherspoon ASSENT: Comstock, Eyerly SUBSTITUTE IOC: Councils Sher moved, seconded by Beehrs, that the City Council endorse the Old Police/Fire Building as the preferred location for the multi -purpose senior canter; and sake a commitment that this Old Police/Fire Wilding will be leased, on a long -terse basis, to the Senior Coordinating Council for this use et a nominal rentals subject to the condition that, within twelve months, the Senior Coordinating Council raise sufficient funds for the renovations necsssery to sake the building nimble for this purpose; and, further, should the Dior Coordinating Council be unable to raise the necessary funds by the end of the twelve months, the City Coil will determine at that time what disposition should be made of the Old Police/Fire Buildin$. 7b 0 3/1/76 Mayor Norton asked the amount of the dollar figure in this regard. Councilman Sher affixed no dollar figure to his cation, indica- ting his intent was to leave the amount open because, as Mr. Stromquist pointed out earlier, the plans presented were by no means f.inal. This would give the Senior Coordinating Council the backboard to bounce the ball against to start raising the funds and see if sufficient funds necessary to convert the building for this purpose can be raised. Vice Mayor Clay stated he voted his conscience on the last motion, and he still felt it to be the right decision. The Task Force report very clearly started the deeds of seniors. Those needs were housing, health care, traueportation, and food. He was concerned that the City Council would be condoning, say, $1 million for development of a project, and none of that amount goes towards serving those needs. Disagreeing with Councilman Seahrs, he thought that to have a building is not the same as having $350,000 cash because that building is only good to the seniors if it is sold; it is of no value to the seniors until they have not only raised whatever is required to renovate the building, but then whatever is required in addition to begin to provide the programs. Corrected See pg. 911 Vice Mayor Clay was sorry that somehow this message and the goal he had, and would like to see, for seniors, is somehow not accepted by the rest of the Council. It was an equally tough decision for him with respect to the motion now before the Council, however, he stated he would vote against Councilman Sher's motion because he felt to pass it would be doing seniors a disservice. If he is wrong, he added, he would be very pleasantly wrong; but if it develops that he is right, he will be very aorry if, to twelve months from now, the needs of seniors are still not served, as is indicated by the Task Force report. Councilwoman Witherspoon agreed with Councils Sher for different reasons, adding that she felt the prudent thing for the seniors to do wculd be to take the $350,000. However, she hes questioned the seniors along this line and is convinced that they want to have a try at setting the 01d Police/Fire Building, and she can see way. One year from now, the seniors will have a much better idea whether they can make it, fund raising -wise, and they will probably have ah better idea of what kind of a program they want. Cohncilwoman Witherspoon asked if Councilman. Sher would be willing to put into his motion that, in addition to the funds raised in the twelve months, there be a very detailed program budget, identifying sources of funding, minds available for Council to review. The City would them know what its commit- ment old be in the futuri and would also have a good idea of how healthy the center would be f inisacially. Councilman Sher vented to know if Councilwomen Witherspoon was simply asking that the'Senior Coordinating Council prepare some kind of a proposed budget for programs to be conducted. Councils Witherspoon indicated this would be a detailed cost -analysed budget. 761 3/1/76 7', f, . Councilman Sher had uo objection but did not think that this was related to the physical facility. However, he thought it to be an appropriate request to make of the Senior Coordinating Council and that the SCC would be happy to respond as to their plans for programs to be carried on at the senior center. He :-,ould not like to see this request tacked on as a condition because his motion contemplaEtes making the commitment tonight that this is the preferred site, and the City will lease the building on a long-term baais to the Senior Coordinating Council. Certainly, he would jcin Couucilwoean Witherspoon in requesting this information in a separate motion, or in some other way; he did not think a motion to this effect was necessary, since the SCC would be working this year on proposed programs and, indeed, such would probably be part of their fund raising effort. Councilwoman Witherspoon disagreed slightly. She had thought since last August, that the Council would be getting a detailed cost analysis. She noted that the SCC probably had not had time to accomplish this since they have been worried about the building. Her decision a year from now, as to whether or not the Senior Coordinating Council has raised sufficient money and has additionally given her enough confidence to know that they can carry the ball from then on, is going to be conditional on their programs and their budgets, and their ability to raise the money this coming year. Councilman Sher said he would second Councilwomen Witherspoon's motion after his passes. Her requeet that SCC provide a budget he thought to be a fine idea. Dr. Walter Bartz, Chairman of the Tesk Force on Aging, stated that at this time last year, the Task Force was in the midst of their deliberations to try to deliver to the Council a model program for development of a senior citizens program for Palo Alto, fn so doing, they considered Palo Alto uniquely capable of developing a model program, Palo Alto being a city with great civic pride to bold up not only to itself, but to surrounding cities as well. They surveyed the city and its resources and determined they could come out with an excellent program for a senior center, badly needed in Palo Alto. Thousands of hours were spent assessing needs. They were explicit in the need for 17,000-18,000 squera feet as a Milli , not 5, ,10,000 square feet. The Teak Force took, as a prototype, Little House id Menlo Park, a meter of tremendous pride end value to the area. At 17,000-18,000 square feet, it is barely edequate, and Little House voul.d like to expand. Thous, it wen felt that here, they should start from that premise and work from that point. On the queetion of City, Senior Coordinating Council, and comity involvement, Dr. Borts rated this has been a problem of joint concern, but they have been considering this and other problems for a year. His ezortation tonight wee "let's get on with it." The Senior Coordinating Council feels they have a tremendous resource that needs herneasing and encouragement; they are anxious to harness the community's enthusiasm and efforts and get on with the center. 762 3/1/76 762 Dr. Bortz understood that the question of City .involvement was a responsible detail Councilman Berwald and others wanted to address. A very responsible motion was now on the floor which seeks to address thia matter, and speaking personally, and from his past position as Task Force Chairman, Dr. Bortz heartily endorsed that motion as a way to get the SCC .terted. Staff, City Council, even the Task Force have seemed to saty repetitively that they must be careful before proceeding with the program and examine it closely, Dr. Bartz said it ehoeld be given a try. The Senior Coordinating Council is trying to tap and energise the community's uncharged capability. Dr. Bartz asked Councilmembera to show the SCC enthusiasm and support of their efforts to try to develop a model city community prograaa far the aging. He suggested everyone ryas going to be there sooner or later and thus it was everybody' e job, not just that of City Council or of the Senior Coordinetieg Council. Dr. Bortz, in conclusion, gave credence to Councilman Sher's motion and urged the Council to think earnestly on supporting it. Councilman Carey noted that Councilman Sher did not mend his motion along Councilwoman Witherspoon's suggestion but said that if his passed, hers will .follow. He did not think that Council could give the Senior Coordinating Council a conditional commitment to have the Old Police/Fire Building so that they can go out and raise the funds. 7f Council was concerned about the annual operating costs of that completed structure for senior citizens, they had better address themselves to it now, not later, because he did not think the City could give SCC a year to go out and raise $1 million to renovate the building, then decide that the annual operating costs are too high, and their ability to pay for them from sources other than the City is too risky. He saw the possibility of the City's not being able to provide funds and then being put in the position of having to take the building back. Councilman Carey felt that the matter had to be decided this evening before the Council committed the building for ari twelve months' period. He said he a ouid vote against Councilman Sher's motion, and if it failed, he would recommend that Council adopt the original Policy and Procedures Committee's recommendation. Councilman Berwald asked to hear tha notion again. Councilman Sher read the motion. Councilman Bervaald asked if Councilmen Sher keew what the potential commitment of the City would be as t result of this motion. Councilman Sher responded that as he would approbate it, . it is simply a condition to lot the buildin sit is its present state, for one year, while the fend —raisins effort is going forward. He noted there wee some indication the building would have to sit there anyway, aisthere le certain litigation undaervay involving - the buildin . in his view, one more year was not eny kind of sebstential commitmeat., CounciIman old responded that he yes this of the commitment ent 7 6 3 3#1/76 763 after the lease was signed. Councilman Sher explained that his motion contemplates nothing along those lines as far as a commitment beyond when the lease is signed. Councilman Berwald remarked that, in otherwords, the Senior Coordinating Council could raise the funds, end the City would sign a lease without knowing what the commitment of the City was, in terms of operating costs, maintenance costs, etc. Councilmen Sher said that Councilwoman Witherspoon suggested, and he has agreed, that during this period, the Council would also receiving from SCC a program laying out the activities to be carried on at the senior center and the costs connected thereto. Be acknowledged that hit motion does say that the building would be leased for a multi -purpose *senior center; in the terms of the lease, it would have to be used for that purpose, and eo if there was some depression yet to occur or there wet no money available for any activities there to carry on a multi -purpose senior center, he supposed that might be cause for termination of the leave. He repeated his earlier hope that there would be some endowment that would be raised during this fund-raising pericd to carry on programs. He said that undoubtedly the City would be approached to participate in programs, and such support would have to be reviewed from year to year in the context of the regular budget process, to see what the City could then afford to do. Councilman 1 rwald posed the rhetorical eueation that if Councilman Sher or those who were wilding to support this motion knew that at the end of the budget year, the City away have to substantially increase revenues, meaning increase taxes or add pew uses to balance the budget and to provide existing services, would the Council still be taking this action tonight without referral to the Finance and Public Works Committee. The Old Police/Fire building is a public works, ho stated, and it doss involve finance and, as he had said before, he did not think the Council should take actions such as this without knowing all of the facto, what the long-term commitments are, and, particularly, not knowing hater mach the City can invest. With that in mind, Councilman bervasld said be would suggest tbat Council defer action an this matter pending Finance and Public Works Committee's review of the budget, including the potential effects of this proposal. Councilman Bethrs remarked that be thought they v+ere getting the welters very muddy. A11 the proponents of this propositioo want is a fleet* indication from the City Council as to what they 0.11 do, and he would say that they are aakin a building aveileble, as m awaits, Ha saw some hazard in Couctlercaen Witherspoonrs proposal for the simple reason tat, implicitly, it suggests the idea thet this City Coi*dl 404 this City is going to coves up with'the budgetary needs of the progra3. This is not the case, as be ewe it. If Councilman Sheet motion passes,"that is it - the City wakes s building available end if tbs funds cast be retied, the Oal is off.., There is no commitment whatever to the program eAd ho meted shut understood. If the Senior Coordinating &meal ceneot rides 764 3/1/76 the money, that is too bad. He felt that was all they want -- a base or a backboard from which to operate. For Councilman Beahrs' part, the building is theirs. If the Council wants to introduce the questions suggested by Councilwoman Witherspoon, it would be appropriate to review the SCC's program, but Council- man Beahrs would not undertake such review with the idea that he would be making a commicext tonight or in the future that Council would give one dime to the program, except, possibly, on N personal basis es a dues -paying member. Councilman Carey felt that it would be made clear that if this motion passes, there is no commitment. Any analysis now of wit the annual operating costs would bs is misleading; if it is a condition in anyone's mind to the seniors having twelve months in which to raise the money, he thought they should get it out now. He was reluctant to have the Senior :coordinating Council spend twelve months raising, the money and then find out they really do not have it. He felt that if the Council makes the commitmert, ail the SCC has to do is raise the money. Mayor Norton said that the motion itself includes the term "commitment," It way be used in a somewhat different context, he noted, but it's there, The substitute motion was approved on the following vote: AYES: Beahrs, Carey, Sher, Witherspoon NOES: 3erwa1d, Clay, N,crton ABSENT: Comstock, Byerly Mayor Norton believed Councilman Berwald's point well taken that this matter should be referred to the Finance and Public Works Committee for its review in the course of budget discussions. Councilman Berwald said that he would make the motion, since Councilman Sher's substitute motion passed, noting his only reason for voting against the motion was his feeling that this natter should go to Finance and Public Works Committee; he was not against the idea of committing the building. But he felt that the Finance and Public Works Committee should have some direction from the Council to look at the pros and cons and provide whatever information they can back to Council. MOTION: Councilman Be weld moved, seconded by Horton, that the financial aspects of the Council's endorsement of tbe Old Police/Fire Building as the preferred location for the multi -purpose senior center be referred to the Finance and Public Works Committee for discussion and report at the time that Committee presents the budget to the Council. Councilwomen Witherspoon Asked if Councilmen 3ervald newt this referral to be for this cling budget year (1976-77)i or the next budget year, when the Senior Coor4inating Council will have an idea of bow mach they have in ham. 765 3/1/76 Councilman Berwald responded it would be done in both years but that he was the Committee Chairman this year and would like to see it reviewed for 1976-77 budget year. Councilwoman Withersp000n stated she would like the Finance and Public Works Committee to review some kind of preliminary budget from the Senior Coordinating Council, if they have one for their program. She did not know that it would stake much difference to review it this year, because the SCC would not be coming to the Council for anything before 1977--78 budget year, except for what is in the budget process for 1976-77 budget. Councilman Berwald said that the nuance and Public Works Committee would weigh the proposal against they needs of the City and advantages of poseible disposal of the property. Councilman Sher commented he did not regard this as the motion that Councilwoman Witherspoon suggested she night make, and so be was going to vote against it because the motion has to do with the financial aspects of this matter. He pointed out that the wetter that has been voted on, in his view, really does not have any kind of financial implications for the City, other than taking the building available, if the funds are raised by SCC. Councilwoman Witherspoon commented that she was beginning to think that her point is a year early. Mayor Dorton said that he would vote for the motion and that if Councilman Berwald wanted retain this matter in Committee for a year, that was his business. Vice Mayor Clay thought that the motion was after the fact and could be misleading unless Chairmen Berwald were going to hold it in Committee for something like nine smiths, pending a response back from the seniors, and that berg the case, it could be referred at that time. 8e did not think he could support the motion. The motion failed on the following vote: AiES: Berwald, Norton, Witherspoon NOES: Bea►hrs, Carey, Clay, Sher ABSENT: Comstock, Eyerly Mayor Norton suggested CoUr1l adjourn the meeting of Febeear-y 2i, 1376; and convene the meeting of March 1, 1976. He would then move that lteso 7 be braaght forward on the agenda, solely for purposes of cotiauleg the matter for thirty days. He _ cc teed there were interested people present, and he doubted that Council would be able to :address the issue meaninv fully tonight. given the lateness of the boor. Additionally, hA itndicatad that staff might welcome the possibility of a continuance to leis thee to talk to additional neighbors iavolved'in the matter. 7 6 6 3/1/76 r0 ADJOURNMENT OFmAgETING OF FEBFARY 23 smiga MOTION: Mayor Norton moved, eeconded by Berwald, that the meeting of February 23, 1976, be adjourned. The motion was approved on a unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and Eyeriy ,absent. The meeting of February 23, 1976, was adjourned at 10:15 p.m. 7A I'1 F 2iMcH 1 _ 1476_ The City Council of the City of Palo Alto met on this date at 10:15 p.m. in a regular meting with Mayor Norton presiding. Present: Beahra, Eerwield, Carey, Clay Norton, Sher, Witherspoon Absent: Comstock, Eyeriy ad ss1�11a1 w MOTION: Mayor Norton roved, seconded by Beahrs, that item 7 be brought forward on the agenda at this time, solely for purposes of a continuance, the continuance being for approxi- mately thirty days. The motion was approved on unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and Eyeriy absent. MOTION: Mayor Norton :Waved, seconded by Berweld, that Item 7 regarding the Ban Antonio Way - Demonstration Project, be continued for approximately thirty .days. Mayor Norton asked Mr. Sipel when this matter would appear before Council. Mt. Sipel responded that this isaua would be agendise►d on Monday, April 5. Mayor Norton hoped staff can reconcile what he underetands to be different points of view on neighbors' part. Be thought it would be salutary if that happened. Councilman B *rwal..d raid be would not make a motion but would like to have staff consider the danger of left turns et Fern and increaee4 traffic on Fern. He ward against creating more hazard.* in that ern. The motion to continua for thirty days wee approved on a unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and gyerly absent. 7 0 7 3/1/76. TEM 6 BE BROUGHT MOTION: Vice Mayor Clay moved, seconded by E€rwald, that Item 6 re PAAIRS Contract be brought forward on the agenda for consideration at this point. The motion was approved on a unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and Eyerly absent. p Contr�� (1 :184:6) MOTION: Vice Mayor Clay moved, seconded by Norton, that Item 6 regarding the Palo Alto Area Information and Referral 3ervice (PAAIRS) Contract, be continued to next week's meeting, March 8, 1976. The motion to continue one week was approved on a unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and Eyerly absent. The meeting adjourned to Executive Session regarding 1iti.gatio>i at 10:20 p.m. and reconvened at 12.01 a.m. 15. 1976 NOTION: Mayor Norton moved, seconded. by Beahrs, that the minutes of January 15, 1976, be approved as submitted. The motion passed on a unanimous vote. Councilman Carey requested that on page 571, at line 9,- "t estty-eighth" be changed to "eighteenth". Vice Mayor Clay reg ated the addition of the word "in" following the word "dif€erence",.appearing at the end of lies 18, page 571. Councilman Mahn: requested that the typographical error following the word "Business" is: line 24 page 573,, be reed. Councilman Beahrs requested the words "the proposed merger" be substituted for the word "Council" on the 3rd line of paragraph 6, page 577. MOTION: Councilmen Sealers wed, seconded by Nortoa, that the minutes of the meeting of Jenuair^y 19, 1976, he approved es corrected. The motion passed on .a antes vote. FUSE DISPOSAL AREA: AWARD OF cxR:178:6) MOTION: Councilman Berwald moved, seconded by Norton, that this item be removed from the Consent Calendar and continued, for one creek, to March 8, 1976. The motion to remove the item from the Consent Calendar and continue for one week vas approved on the following vote: RTES: Berwald, Carey, Clay, Norton, Witherspoon NOES: Beaters, Sher ABSENT: Comstock, Eyerly MOTION: Mayor Norton moved, seconded by Beahrer that the City Council authorize the staff to transmit the staff report to the Santa Clara County Planning Policy Committee as representing Palo Alto'a official position with regard to the County's request to revise "sphere of influence" Fief snit ions. The motion was approved on a unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and Eyerly absent. FINANCE ' D PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE MOTION: Councilman Berwald, Chairman of the Finance .and Public Works Committee, coved, aeconded by Norton, the Crmmi,ttee'e recommendation re Newspaper flacks, to amend the budget by $4,600 to contract with Veterans' Workshop to build the seven receptacles for newspapers and periodicals, and introduced the following ordinance: ORDINANCE NO. 2902 entitled "ORDINANCE OF THE COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF PALO ALTO AMENDING THE BUDGET FOR THE FISCAL YEAR 1975-76 TO ESTABLISH A CAPITAL IMPROVE- MENT PROJECT FOR NEWSPAPER RACKS, P EI" Me recommendation vast approved and the ordinance adopted on a unanimous vote, Councilmen Comstock and Eyerly absent. 769 3/1/76 1 FINANCE -;N ' e): . WORKS COMMITTEE MOTION: Councilman Eervald, Chairman of the Finance and Public Works Committee, moved the Committee's recordation regarding Annual Financial Audit Management Letter, that the Controller invite proposals, so that peziodicslly, the City will have a new auditor. The motion passed on a unanimous vote, Councilman Comstock and Eyerly absent. MOTION: Councilran Carey moved, ascended by Sher, that this matter be continued to Unfinished Business for one veek, to March 8, 1976. The motion passed on a unanimous vote, with Councilmen Comstock and Eyerly absent. 04401ENTfl MOTION: Councilman l eabr'a moved, seconded by Norton, that the ,meeting of March 1, 1976, be adjourned. The action vas approved on a unanimous vote. The meeting was ad j ourn»ed st 12:11 a .m. on Tuesday, March 2, 1976. ATTEST: APB: