HomeMy WebLinkAbout2017-11-28 Parks & Recreation Summary MinutesAPPROVED
1
2
3
4
MINUTES 5
PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION 6
REGULAR MEETING 7
NOVEMBER 28, 2017 8
CITY HALL 9 250 Hamilton Avenue 10 Palo Alto, California 11 12 Commissioners Present: Anne Cribbs, Jeff Greenfield, Jeff LaMere, Ryan McCauley, Don 13
McDougall, David Moss, and Keith Reckdahl 14
Commissioners Absent: None 15
Others Present: 16
Staff Present: Daren Anderson, Catherine Bourquin, Kristen O'Kane 17
I. ROLL CALL CONDUCTED BY: Catherine Bourquin 18
II. AGENDA CHANGES, REQUESTS, and DELETIONS: 19
Chair Reckdahl: We have Agenda Changes, Requests, Deletions. 20
III. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS: 21
Chair Reckdahl: We'll move on to Oral Communications. We have no speaker cards, so 22
we'll move on to Department Report. 23
IV. DEPARTMENT REPORT 24
Kristen O'Kane: Good evening, Chair and Commissioners. Kristen O'Kane, Community 25 Services. I have a few announcements, and then I'll turn it over to Daren Anderson, who 26 has some more updates. The first thing I wanted to mention is on December 5 we're 27 having a community meeting and stakeholder meeting on the Baylands Comprehensive 28
Conservation Plan that's currently underway. The meeting is December 5 from 10:30 to 29
noon. It's at the Mitchell Park Community Center. We do, I believe, have two 30
Commissioners who have already agreed to participate. I would ask that if anyone else 31
did want to attend to either let Daren or I know. It's a community meeting, but it's not a 32
public meeting in the sense that we're not posting it like we would a normal public 33
Approved Minutes 1
APPROVED
meeting. We just want to ensure we aren't violating the Brown Act. If anyone would like 1
to come or would at least like the materials from the meeting, please let Daren or I know. 2
Chair Reckdahl: Do you have any idea what kind of crowd we're getting? Daren, have 3
you gotten feedback from people? 4
Daren Anderson: No. The typical group is 25 approximately, and that's a mix of some 5
staff and traditional stakeholders at the Baylands. This has been posted all throughout the 6 Baylands. The Rangers are talking to people and putting it on their social media. It's 7
really hard to tell because that stakeholder group is the crew that usually comes to most 8
of those public meetings. I really don't know how many (crosstalk). 9
Chair Reckdahl: Somewhere in the neighborhood of 20 would be a good guess. 10
Mr. Anderson: I would think. 11
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you. 12
Commissioner McDougall: This is December 5th, right? 13
Ms. O'Kane: That's correct. The second announcement I wanted to make is that this 14
Friday is the annual Tree Lighting at Lytton Plaza. That event starts at 5:30. It would be 15
great to see you all there. One last thing is I wanted to mention that the Senior New 16
Year's Eve Brunch that we have every year is going to be held on Friday, December 29 17
this year. I wanted to let everyone know that tickets are now on sale. If you're interested 18
in attending, it will be at Mitchell Park Community Center again in the El Palo Alto 19
Room. 20
Chair Reckdahl: This is for senior citizens? You said senior. 21
Ms. O'Kane: It's geared toward seniors, but anyone can attend. I'll turn it over to Daren 22
now for his updates. 23
Mr. Anderson: Daren Anderson, Open Space, Parks, and Golf. I've got just a few 24
updates for you. One pertains to the closed trails up at Foothills Park. This is both our 25 Costanoan and Los Trancos Trails. Approximately 3 miles of the Los Trancos Trail and 26 about 0.83 mile of the Costanoan have been closed going on a year. I think we've 27 recounted often enough the steps we've taken so far. Since we last updated the 28
Commission, I wanted to give you the latest. We've walked the site with the two 29
consultants to do the biological and cultural evaluations. I went with them personally. 30
We hiked the trail. This is the rerouted section or proposed rerouted section. The intent 31
of the biological and cultural is to see if there are any issues that would cause us to have 32
to move that proposed trail somewhere else. I just got the reports back the other day, and 33
there are no cultural issues with any of the proposed reroutes. There were a couple of 34
Approved Minutes 2
APPROVED
woodrat trails in close proximity to the rerouted one. There are two options. One is we 1
move that proposed alignment over a little bit or we'll hire another biologist to work with 2
us during construction. They have to be onsite to ensure we're not affecting the woodrat 3
at all. It'll probably be some combination of the two depending on if I can find 30-60 feet 4
away from that trail alignment that doesn't have another woodrat nest. We shall see. 5
That's the status on the cultural and biological. They're making a couple of edits, and I 6 should have those reports back with my feedback. I also requested a price quote from 7
that same consultant to do the necessary CEQA analysis, which is the next step before 8
construction. They're researching exactly what CEQA analysis is necessary. Sometimes 9
CEQA can be very broad, and sometimes it can be a little more smaller in scope. They're 10
doing that homework for me, and I should have an answer by the end of the week in 11
terms of what that CEQA looks like and how much it'll cost. If it's over $10,000, I'll have 12
to get three bids, but I'll expedite that process. I've already got some consultants in line 13
that I know to go to for this kind of work. We'll proceed once I have that information. 14
The other information I wanted to share with you (crosstalk). 15
Chair Reckdahl: One question. CEQA would take a couple of months? 16
Mr. Anderson: Yes, approximately. 17
Chair Reckdahl: At that point, we're free to go out to bids for the construction? 18
Mr. Anderson: Yes. The CEQA analysis might put a constraint on the window of work. 19
That's entirely possible. One of them would be the bird nesting season. That was 20
actually in the biological assessment. I've asked for them to consider an alternative such 21
as again another biologist to do a survey for nesting birds in the construction area. If 22
we're limited to that bird nesting season, it really leaves only a month or so outside the 23
rainy season, which I don't think is practical. Again, I've asked for that change in the 24
biological survey with that stipulation. There are some other alternatives to consider that 25 won't hold us up. 26
Chair Reckdahl: Would this involve hand construction or they actually have machines? 27
Mr. Anderson: It'll be a mix. The contractor that we've traditionally used for a lot of the 28
trail work has a mini excavator. It's no wider than my shoulders really, but very handy. 29
He usually supplements that with two or three staff people to come in with hand tools. 30
Chair Reckdahl: Thanks. 31
Mr. Anderson: Sure. The other update pertained to the Cubberley bleachers. About 6 32
months ago or so, there are two very large bleachers on either side of the field 33
traditionally. One had failed, and we replaced that about 6 months ago with two smaller 34
bleachers. The other side, very large bleachers that have been used a lot of times for 35
Approved Minutes 3
APPROVED
training—people will run up and down those bleachers for exercise—and sometimes for 1
watching games and events on the synthetic turf field at Cubberley. It had to be closed. 2
The wood's badly broken. The structure itself is sound. I might have mentioned to the 3
Commission before that we had looked into options of complete replacement. The costs 4
were through the roof, in the way of $300,000 for a comparably sized bleacher. We 5
could do the repairs ourselves, buy the wood, and have a contractor demo the existing, 6 and put it in ourselves for somewhere around $15,000-$20,000, far more reasonable and 7
practical and made sense. I last updated the Commission saying it looked to be a 3-4 8
week process. I was wrong; I apologize. The purchasing process is taking longer than 9
we thought. The materials, that quantity of wood for the bleachers is an 8-week time 10
period to get it. It's a little longer than I thought. I apologize for that. We'll have it 11
completed by the end of February or beginning of March, which is the realistic time 12
schedule. Fortunately, just across the field there are two bleachers existing for people 13
that need a place to sit. It's not as if we're without bleachers. That's all my updates. 14
Commissioner Greenfield: Regarding the bleacher timeline, is the ETA posted on the 15
bleachers or (crosstalk). 16
Mr. Anderson: Yes. I had the old sign up until recently, but we're correcting it. I just 17
got the new information yesterday morning. 18
Commissioner Greenfield: Thank you. 19
V. BUSINESS: 20
1. Approval of Draft Minutes from the October 24, 2017 Parks and Recreation 21
Commission meeting. 22
Approval of the draft October 24, 2017 Minutes was moved by Commissioner 23
McDougall and seconded by Commissioner Cribbs. Passed 7-0 24
2. Peers Park Dog Park – Park Improvement Ordinance 25
Chair Reckdahl: We'll move onto the first business. A long time waiting, Peers Park dog 26 park. Daren, you have the floor. 27
Mr. Anderson: Good evening. Daren Anderson, Open Space, Parks, and Golf. I'm very 28
pleased to come to you tonight requesting an action item to seek a recommendation from 29
the Commission for Council to adopt the Park Improvement Ordinance to add the dog 30
park at Peers Park. We've discussed this topic extensively, so I'll keep my presentation 31
brief. Let me start, though, with a correction. Commissioner McCauley helped me by 32
finding an error on my draft Park Improvement Ordinance. This is Section 2. There's a 33
reference to the Baylands Lucy Evans Interpretive Center. Let me read what it should 34
Approved Minutes 4
APPROVED
say. It should say in Section 2: Council hereby approves a plan for construction of a dog 1
off-leash area at Peers Park. Hereto attached as Exhibit A is part of the official plan for 2
construction of a dog off-leash area at Peers Park. I'll make those corrections. I think the 3
Commission can still approve that, and we'll move it on to Council. A real quick 4
background. In 2006, staff hosted a community meeting to specifically talk to the 5
community about adding a dog park at Peers. The community was generally in support 6 of that idea. The big advantages of Peers were the size. We could have a dog park at this 7
site that's 0.72 acre, which would be by far the biggest dog park we have. Also the 8
proximity to the existing train tracks in that park helps negate the noise issue associated 9
with dog parks often. At the March 2017 Commission meeting, the Commission 10
expressed support for the idea of adding a dog park at Peers. Staff developed the design 11
using feedback from the Commission, the ad hoc committee, the community at public 12
meetings both recent and past, and feedback we had learned over the years at our three 13
other dog parks. At the July 2017 Commission meeting, the Commission expressed 14
support for moving forward with the Park Improvement Ordinance as soon as it could. 15
We have done so, gotten the approval from Planning. The next steps in the process 16
would be the Council approval of the PIO if the Commission saw fit to approve it. 17
Again, this is the location. Here's the design. The design elements were in the staff 18
report. If there are any questions, I'm glad to go over that. With that, I pass it on to the 19
ad hoc if they have comments. Before I do, I just want to thank this Commission, thank 20
our prior Commissions, thank this ad hoc committee, thank our stakeholders and our 21
community for their patience for how long it took to get here. I'm really grateful, and I 22
think we're very close to building our first new dog park in over 25 years. 23
Commissioner Cribbs: All I would say, Daren, is that I think we're all very excited. 24
Everybody's smiling up here. It's wonderful to have it on its way. When do you 25 anticipate it will be completed? 26
Mr. Anderson: I think the longest process will be soliciting bids and hiring contractors 27 somewhere in a 2-3 month process for that. The construction itself is about 3 weeks, 28
relatively quick. I'll work with purchasing to expedite that 2-3 month window as much as 29
possible. I've worked with Peter, and he's ready to go and get this out to bid. As soon as 30
we can, we're going to … 31
Commissioner Cribbs: Maybe spring? 32
Mr. Anderson: Yes, I believe so. I believe that's very possible. 33
Commissioner Cribbs: That's great. Thank you and all the Staff for everything and 34
certainly the stakeholders—I see some of them in the audience—who tried so hard for so 35
long. Thank you for that. As a dog grandmother, I'm very happy that the dog park will 36
be open. 37
Approved Minutes 5
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: Do you want to say anything else? 1
Commissioner McCauley: Just thank you again. 2
Chair Reckdahl: Howard, is he out there? Do you want to say any words? 3
Howard Hoffman: Thank you. Howard Hoffman representing Palo Alto Dog Owners. 4
We would like to thank the Commissioners, the previous Commissioners and particularly 5
the staff for all their efforts on this. We're very excited at the prospect of finally getting a 6 new dog park. We hope that it won't take 25 years to get the next one after this. Thank 7
you very much. 8
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you, Howard. Thank you for your patience also. We appreciate 9
this. Does anyone else have questions or comments? 10
Commissioner Cribbs: I just have a question about is it appropriate to ask a few 11
questions about the future now or should we go ahead and do the Park Ordinance that we 12
need to do and then come back to that? I don't want to rain on this parade, but I do have a 13
couple of questions. 14
Chair Reckdahl: I have some going forward questions also. Anything going forward, 15
let's wait until after the vote. 16
Commissioner Cribbs: Perfect. That's great. Thank you. 17
Chair Reckdahl: Don. 18
Commissioner McDougall: I just had one question, Daren. In the presentation, there's a 19
small picture here. The pictures shows some signs. I know I've been obnoxious before 20
about what the signs are. I can tell you I went to the Adobe Creek presentation last night. 21
I would say that the thing that almost derailed it was the signs, the signage. I would not 22
like that to happen here. I'd like to suggest you anticipate the question of what kind of 23
signs might they be, how high might they be, etc. It was a big issue last night 24
Mr. Anderson: Thank you for that. On our next agenda topic, we'll be getting into a little 25 bit about the dog park rules and the signage associated with that. 26
Commissioner McDougall: Thank you. 27
Commissioner McCauley: Don, just for the broader Commission's benefit, we had a 28
fairly lengthy discussion about the signage when we met with stakeholders last month. 29
We can talk about that when we get to the park rules component. 30
Approved Minutes 6
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: I do have one question about the turf and the mulch. Right now, it's a 1
mixture of that, and we're going to keep that. Is there a preference in the dog community 2
for mulch versus grass or is it some people like one and some people like the other? 3
Mr. Anderson: Before we get comments from the public, if we'd like to, I can share what 4
I've heard. I think the preference is grass if you can keep it in great shape. That's often 5
the challenge in the dog park. We're a little bit aided here in that we've got 0.72 acre of 6 it. About half is mulch. I think it's going to be a mix. The areas that are currently mulch 7
will remain mulch largely because they're under a tree canopy. It'd be very difficult to 8
make it grass anyway. I think what we're going to try to do is just put in good dog paw-9
friendly mulch and sustain the turf. 10
Chair Reckdahl: The problem is that lawn gets beat up. Maybe the question is what is 11
preferred, a beat-up lawn or mulch. Is mulch objectionable to the dog community is a 12
better question. 13
Mr. Anderson: I can tell you from the experience of Mitchell Park where we've got half 14
turf and half decomposed granite. We had asked which way do you want to go. A 15
number of times we'd go out. That site, the turf is pretty small and difficult to sustain. 16
We thought, "Would you like to go to something else? Would you like either mulch or 17
more decomposed granite?" There was a definite sizable community that wanted turf. 18
They just had frustration about you have to rest that turf. You have to do restorations 19
almost annually. 20
Chair Reckdahl: This is big enough that maybe we can fence off portions of it and give it 21
some rest now and then. 22
Mr. Anderson: Of course, we'll do feedback with this being a dog park and see if the 23
grass is fading. We'll come out and talk to users and see if there are other alternatives, if 24
they want to expand the mulch in certain areas. Certainly don't want dogs in the mud. 25
Chair Reckdahl: Any questions or do we move on to a motion? Do I have a motion? 26 We'll let the ad hoc. 27
MOTION 28
Commissioner McCauley: I would move to approve the Park Improvement Ordinance as 29
amended by Daren. 30
Chair Reckdahl: You want to second? 31
Commissioner Cribbs: Please. 32
Chair Reckdahl: We have a second. All in favor. Opposed. Passed [7-0]. 33
Approved Minutes 7
APPROVED
3. Draft Revisions to Dog Park Rules 1
Chair Reckdahl: We'll move on to the next item which is the change of the rules. I guess 2
you talk first, Daren, and then we'll move on. We have one speaker. Howard wants to 3
say a few words. 4
Mr. Anderson: Very good. Daren Anderson with Open Space, Parks and Golf. 5
Tonight's item on dog park rules is a discussion topic, not action. In preparation for 6 opening this new dog park, it seems appropriate to review and update our existing dog 7
park rules. On October 10, staff met with the Commission ad hoc committee and a few 8
dog park stakeholders to discuss rules that would be appropriate. The first page of the 9
staff report lists the existing rules that are found in the City's Park and Open Space 10
Regulations, R1-32. Those existing rules define which parks have designated off-leash 11
areas, the hours of operation for those dog parks. They require picking up of dog waste, 12
prohibiting of leaving dogs unattended, and require putting a muzzle on aggressive dogs. 13
Rather than editing those because almost every single one we wanted to reword and 14
change substantially, we started from scratch. On the second page of the staff report, you 15
see these new proposed, completely rewritten rules. All the proposed rules are fairly 16
common and consistently found in other municipalities' dog parks. We did a lot of 17
checking of what other agencies have used and picked and pulled the ones that seemed 18
the most appropriate for our site. Rather than read each one, I want to briefly discuss 19
some thought process behind a few of them that really stand out and beg conversation. 20
The first of which is the no more than three dogs per person rule. While this is a common 21
rule at many other dog parks, it's new to Palo Alto. We haven't had that. It has been an 22
issue. We have a lot of commercial dog walkers, and it's been increasing in recent years. 23
For many years, they would come out and use the dog parks and bring more than three 24
dogs. A number of residents throughout the years have come to me, and in the last 2 25 years it's been more complaining about this, saying they want me to do something. We 26 don't have anything on the books that precludes that. They've been advocating for me to 27 add something. This is the opportune time to address their concern. I also spoke with a 28
commercial dog walker. He was very sympathetic and understood that this was not 29
popular and that very few places allow it. He said he really wanted to work with us and 30
asked if we could do this. I promised to bring this to the Commission and express his 31
willingness to work with the Commission. He mentioned that financially it's difficult for 32
them to have 1:3 ratio of their dog walkers. It's typically more along the lines of 1:5 or 33
1:6, which was not something our residents wanted. The ones we've spoken to do not 34
want that. There's that conflict; I wanted to be forthright and share that with you. Our 35
group that discussed it felt that it is not reasonable for someone to bring more than three 36
dogs to a dog park and be able to supervise those dogs, which is an important part of 37
bringing a dog to the dog park for the safety of those dogs and everyone else in that area. 38
It just isn't possible to take six dogs and really look after them and pick up after them. 39
That was the rationale for that rule. The second one I wanted to talk about was the small 40
Approved Minutes 8
APPROVED
dog section being for 35 pounds for less. The mixed dog section is for both large and 1
small dogs. We went back and forth on this issue of the right limit to put on this. We 2
weren't quite sure. Again, when I looked at different municipalities, there was a big 3
range. You can make compelling arguments for a lot of different ones. This is where we 4
settled after discussing it for about an hour. This one rule was among several that we 5
discussed. This one was a particular challenge to come up with the right one. Our 6 stakeholders who are in the audience today were instrumental in saying, "This is the right 7
way. I've been in this park. I've seen the kinds of dogs and the weights. My personal 8
opinion is 35 pounds or less is appropriate for the small dog area." The last rule I want to 9
discuss is the dog park hours. In our proposed rules, it says hours are from 7:00 a.m. to 10
9:00 p.m. The existing rules have the hours from sunrise to 10:30 p.m., which is 11
consistent with the general park hours, the normal park hours for all our parks. However, 12
sunrise is at 5:30 during the summer at certain times, which is very early to have dogs in 13
the dog park. 10:30 p.m. year-round is also pretty late to have dog parks. All of our 14
existing dog parks are unlit, and so is this one. It might not be a place where they want to 15
come. Our group, as we discussed this, felt 7:00 to 9:00 was more reasonable. If there 16
were dogs barking or being loud or obnoxious or problematic after or before those hours, 17
it would give some recourse to neighbors to take action and call for help from Animal 18
Services. If you stuck with the original hours, the hands are tied of those law 19
enforcement officials. The ad hoc committee and the stakeholders also discussed an 20
addition to a sign with these general rules of a friendly welcoming sign asking visitors to 21
be considerate of neighbors and help keep the dog park clean and quiet. That concludes 22
my presentation. Again, I'd like to thank the ad hoc committee, Brian Stell and Howard 23
Hoffman for helping compose these draft rules. 24
Chair Reckdahl: Before we go to the Commission, we have a speaker. Howard Hoffman 25 wants to speak on the dog park rules. 26
Howard Hoffman: Thank you again. Again, I wanted to commend the staff, particularly 27 Daren Anderson on not just what we came up with but the whole process. I thought it 28
was very inclusive. The improvements in the rules, I think, are going to be better for the 29
people and the dogs of Palo Alto. Thank you all for considering this. 30
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you, Howard. We have one more speaker here. This is Brian 31
Stell. 32
Brian Stell: Hi, I'm Brian Stell, and I have no great news. I go there every day, and I talk 33
with the people about the park and try to get if there any things that we're not 34
considering. So far, everything that Daren's discussed has been exactly in line with what 35
I've heard from people at the park. There has been no "this is not what I like." There 36
hasn't been any of that. The issue of the small dog area has been asked about. I agree 37
with Daren that, because it's under trees, you're not going to grow grass there. For the big 38
Approved Minutes 9
APPROVED
and small mixed-use area, they repeatedly asked for grass. I think the assumption is it 1
will be nice grass and not ripped up, muddy grass. That's a different issue. I had called 2
Daren's coworker, Mark, about once every 2 or 3 months to have broken sprinklers fixed 3
because I care about mud puddles for the dogs. When there's a broken sprinkler, that's a 4
problem. Otherwise, everything including all the rules are pretty much in agreement with 5
everybody. The one rule that I think a little bit differently about and I've heard some 6 other people is the weight of the dogs. My concern is not the dogs interacting, like a big 7
dog bullying a small dog. That doesn't happen that much. In fact, often small dogs bully 8
big dogs. That's more common. My dog plays with another dog, and they are pretty 9
rough. They're not mean, they don't draw blood, but they are rough and tumble. I'm still 10
a little concerned about a 35-pound dog rolling on top of a 9-pound dog. My personal 11
preference is to go a little bit lower. I would live with 35 pounds, and that would be okay 12
with me. I think everybody can't wait for the park to get started. Thank you. 13
Commissioner Reckdahl: Thank you, Brian. Now, we'll go to the Commission. Do 14
people have comments, questions? David. 15
Vice Chair Moss: I have two quick questions. The first one is I'd heard that Astroturf 16
versus mulch, sometimes it's better, sometimes it's worse. What did you decide? Why 17
didn't you go with some Astroturf instead of mulch? 18
Mr. Anderson: Good question. The synthetic turf alternative as a surface is actually 19
pretty popular. It seems to have gained in popularity recently. At a lot of our meetings, I 20
heard that as a theme from a number of people, which wasn't always the case. Before 21
that, there were sometimes concerns about having dogs on synthetic turf. That seems to 22
have changed as a theme in the last couple of years and most notably at those public 23
meetings last year. Predominantly the reason why we haven't considered it is the cost is 24
so much higher than maintaining natural turf or mulch. It's really significant. You have 25 to have an irrigation system for one because you've got to be constantly washing the urine 26 out of there or it can smell pretty bad. They bring in sanitizing—usually consultants or 27 contractors come in and spray sanitizers on there too. It is popular, and I think at some 28
point we should consider it. It wouldn't fit under a $150,000 budget by a long shot for a 29
project like this. 30
Vice Chair Moss: I had no idea. I thought the natural turf was far, far more expensive. 31
I'm wrong. The second question I had is about the professional dog walkers. Really, the 32
only alternative they have is to leave three dogs in the truck and take three dogs out, run 33
them around, and then put them in the truck and take the next three dogs out. I'm 34
wondering did we consider charging them for exclusive usage of one dog park for X 35
hours in a day. It could be 5:30 in the morning to 7:00 a.m. or 9:00-10:00 p.m. or it could 36
be in the middle of the day for an hour. They get exclusive use of it for their six dogs. If 37
Approved Minutes 10
APPROVED
there are two or three, then they have to do it once a week or every third day. I don't 1
know. Did that come up at all? 2
Mr. Anderson: It didn't come up with our discussions with the public nor with the ad 3
hoc. I had that discussion with the people who called me concerned. I was trying to see 4
if there was a way—before coming to the Commission if there was something we could 5
do that would work for them. I think over the last 2 or 3 years I'm talking about maybe 6 20 complaints about this issue. Each time I would say, "Is there a way we can make this 7
work? Do you have ideas or suggestions?" We'd kick around some of those things, if 8
there could be hours of operation that might fit. I never got concurrence on that. They 9
were all opposed to the idea of generally anybody bringing in more than three. They just 10
disliked the idea of commercial activity inside their dog park. 11
Vice Chair Moss: I'm talking about they would pay for that. That's all I had. 12
Commissioner Greenfield: Just one quick question. I'm wondering why the violations, 13
warning rule was omitted? The last rule on the current list. 14
Mr. Anderson: I didn't think it was necessary. These are citable whether I add a thing 15
that says you're citable or not. Having been a park ranger and issued citations, I don't 16
need that to be on there to cite you. We could add it if you think it helps. As we 17
discussed the rules, unless you're going to go with an enormous sign, which we probably 18
aren't, it becomes hard to read when we clutter it up. For the most part, it's going to be 19
that kind of sign. Rule signs generally are the kind that aren't written so you can see it 20
from far away. It's more the kind you would reference if you had a problem with 21
someone who's violating, to say here's a sign that says you can't do A, B, C, and D. I 22
thought it was unnecessary. I'm glad to add it in if we think collectively it needs to be 23
there. 24
Commissioner Greenfield: I don't have strong feelings about it. I was curious on the 25 rationale. That's a good explanation. Thank you. 26
Commissioner McDougall: I have a question that I'd be interested in the committee's 27 comments on. Number 5 there is dogs behaving aggressively. I'm wondering if wording 28
that says dogs displaying aggressive behavior … To me, behaving aggressively means 29
they bit somebody and now it's too late as opposed to a dog that's making an awful lot of 30
noise and is behaving aggressively. I don't know if the wording makes any difference. It 31
doesn't make any difference to the dog; I know that. Does it make any difference to the 32
dog owner in removing a dog that's intimidating everybody else, even if it's isn't biting 33
them? 34
Chair Reckdahl: To me, those two phrases are interchangeable. 35
Approved Minutes 11
APPROVED
Commissioner McCauley: I agree with you that the phrases may be interchangeable. 1
From my own perspective as a dog owner who takes his dog to socialize with other dogs 2
in parks, I will tell you that there's a whole range of dog behaviors. Some dogs growl 3
when they're playing. Some people might be afraid of that sort of thing. Yet, it's just 4
play. As Brian was mentioning, his dog and another large dog might mouth and wrestle 5
and do all those sorts of things that dogs do; yet, that might be to a person who wasn't 6 familiar with that type of dog behavior viewed as aggressive. The language as it is, is 7
probably sufficient. Again, I don't know that there's a distinction between what you had 8
proposed and what's there presently. I agree with Keith on that point. Moreover, I don't 9
want to create a circumstance where you have people tattling on one another or 10
something like that, making too fine an interpretation of these rules. Straightforward, as 11
pithy as we can be with these rules is the best approach. Let me use that as a segue real 12
quickly, and then I'll let Anne dive in too. The second to last one is all dogs bites must be 13
reported to the City of Palo Alto. Are we thinking that this is dog bites of people or dogs 14
biting other dogs? 15
Mr. Anderson: I had understood it to be either. If there was any bite, a bite of another 16
dog or a bite of a person, we would call Animal Services. 17
Commissioner McCauley: I just wonder—it's my own experience that there are a lot of 18
dogs who mouth and play. It's not an aggressive thing at all; it's totally playful. I 19
wouldn't want to have a circumstance where people misinterpret a circumstance and view 20
that as something they call Animal Services over. I wonder whether it might be a better 21
approach—we don't need to land on a conclusion about this tonight—to provide the 22
number for Palo Alto Animal Services and leave out the part about dog bites. Obviously, 23
if a dog ever bites a person or if a dog bites another dog in a malicious way, it's going to 24
get reported. 25
Mr. Anderson: I could also follow up with our Superintendent of Animal Services to get 26 his take on that. That's a good point. I could flesh it out further as well. 27
Commissioner Cribbs: All I would add to that is the ad hoc and the people who were 28
involved tried to make the rules as pithy, as you say, as possible so that they would be 29
easy to understand and fairly straightforward but not to have too many rules and make it 30
relatively friendly, like we're all in this together. I think that's achieved this. They're 31
good. I believe Daren talked about the fact that we could review any of these rules, in a 32
year maybe getting back together, talking about the weight of the dog, the 35-pound dog 33
as opposed to should it be a lesser weight, perhaps listen to three dogs versus four dogs. I 34
think we'll probably stick to three dogs. The opening and closing hours was something 35
we wanted to hear more input about. We thought it was good to get these started and 36
then in a year get back together and review. 37
Chair Reckdahl: The idea is that these … 38
Approved Minutes 12
APPROVED
Commissioner McDougall: I appreciate your comments. Thanks. I support it. 1
Chair Reckdahl: The idea is that these are going to be posted outside every dog park? 2
Mr. Anderson: Yes. 3
Chair Reckdahl: Including the new dog park. Are we aiming to get a version when the 4
construction is done in the spring or are you going to make the construction, put the old 5
dog rules up, and then make a new sign when we formalize this? 6
Mr. Anderson: Either way is possible. I'd like to start it, if possible, with the new rules 7
in place. That would be my ideal. I realize something like this might need more vetting. 8
I look to the Commission to see what else should be done, whether outreach. 9
Chair Reckdahl: In my opinion, these are mature enough that I would feel comfortable 10
making the sign tomorrow. The second rules are better than the first ones. They have 11
more detail. I do have one nitpick. On the very first one at the top of the page, I think 12
you could make it more pithy by striking "designated as such" and adding "in the 13
designated dog exercise areas." That might chop a few words out. Also, in that same 14
sentence, it says "dogs may be allowed off leash." I would say "dogs may be allowed off 15
leash only in the dog exercise area." It infers there are other places they could be. Any 16
other questions? I think this is a good set of rules. We're on the right page. I do want to 17
talk about the path forward for dog parks. 18
Mr. Anderson: Can I ask one quick question, Chair? 19
Chair Reckdahl: Sure. 20
Mr. Anderson: I can, if the Commission would like, come back next month with an 21
action item to adopt this if you would like. 22
Commissioner Cribbs: That's good. 23
Chair Reckdahl: I'm comfortable with that. 24
Mr. Anderson: I'll make it happen. 25
Commissioner McDougall: Daren, while they're talking. I assume the plan is you would 26 have a sign that has all this on it … 27
Mr. Anderson: That's correct, as well as our website. 28
Commissioner McDougall: … as opposed to a sign that says this dog park is under the 29
use of rules such and such and such and such to be found on our website at ... 30
Approved Minutes 13
APPROVED
Mr. Anderson: We'll list them. 1
Commissioner McDougall: You're going to put them out there? 2
Mr. Anderson: Yeah. 3
Chair Reckdahl: As you mentioned, this is the first dog park in 25 years. A lot of people 4
have questions, I think, about the path forward. I'll let Anne have the first chomp at it. 5
Commissioner Cribbs: Thank you, I appreciate that. In the community meetings and in 6 the past discussions we've had talking about the current dog parks that exist and what the 7
plans are for those dog parks and how they're going to get upgraded, my question is going 8
to be when and what is the plan for the three dog parks that we have right now. That's 9
my first question. Second, on the list of future locations that we have in the Master Plan, 10
is there any way to tell how soon we'd be able to activate any of those and what the 11
choices will be? There certainly is a process to go through. In that particular vein, we 12
talked a lot about the potential site right across from the California Avenue railroad 13
station as a potential place, but there seems to be the public art there that seems to have 14
some sort of issue. We wanted to understand on the Commission what that was because 15
it seems like being by the train station is another logical place for a dog park. The same 16
thing with the study that we were going to find about the dogs and oak trees not being 17
compatible. I know that's a lot to respond to. I don't expect you to respond right now. I 18
just want to enjoy this particular dog park. I also would not like to wait 25 years. I'm 19
sure that you guys wouldn't either. Thank you very much. That's it, Keith. 20
Chair Reckdahl: For the remodel costs, they'd be paid by CIPs. What would be the 21
minimum cost if you wanted to remodel or rehab some of these dog parks that we have 22
right now? 23
Mr. Anderson: It really depends on the scope. If we start entertaining options like 24
synthetic turf, it would be significantly higher than anything we have in our operating 25 budget and would certainly be a CIP. If we're talking about something along the lines of 26 adding a fence and maybe some trees and maybe a shade structure, that's different and we 27 could make that happen in certain areas like Mitchell. I think Mitchell really calls for a 28
more robust rehab that would probably need that CIP funding. What I recommend is we 29
get together with the ad hoc and probably the Commission and come up with a 30
recommendation on—we'll have $150,000 in FY '19 for another dog park if everything 31
gets approved, but that's the current plan. That'd be the second option. 32
Chair Reckdahl: $150,000? 33
Mr. Anderson: $150,000. 34
Approved Minutes 14
APPROVED
Commissioner Cribbs: For another dog park? 1
Mr. Anderson: It could be a new dog or it could be renovating … 2
Commissioner Cribbs: We could take that $150,000 and put it … 3
Mr. Anderson: That's correct. We had all three of our existings called out for 4
improvement of some kind. Greer, which is woefully undersized, we look at a 5
repositioning within that park, significantly larger. The same thing with Hoover, that 6 one's too small. We could do in the interim other improvements. That Hoover fence is 7
way too low. I've heard that from countless park users. I don't know why they put it in 8
so low. That could be remedied. It is popular; it's just so small that they need to use the 9
entire outfield to meet the dog park needs in that area. 10
Commissioner Cribbs: It would be fun for the ad hoc to look at that, but I'd also like to 11
look at it as a test case for any potential community fundraising. When we were at the 12
community meetings last winter, I was very impressed that the dog supporters were very 13
interested in helping to support the dog parks. If there were specific things, maybe this 14
would be a way to test that. 15
Chair Reckdahl: That's something the ad hoc should talk to Howard or other dog users 16
and see what do they want, what would they be willing to pay for. That'd be a good ad 17
hoc topic. David. 18
Vice Chair Moss: More specifically, if we could do two parks in the timeframe that it 19
would normally be to do one park because of funding, maybe we could help to limit the 20
amount that it costs from the CIP with some outside fundraising. Stretch those dollars. 21
Commissioner LaMere: I have one comment as I was thinking about one of the rules 22
about the dog walkers and what David had mentioned about the dog walkers. I'm not 23
very familiar with the process of the dog walkers in terms of their commercial activity 24
and how often they're using the dog parks currently. As we build other dog parks or we 25 make these rules that push them out, think about the unintended consequences in terms of 26 what other areas become impacted. Does that mean they're going to other parks and 27 letting their dogs roam around other parks or go into other areas? Perhaps think about if 28
they're not allowed in the dog parks, which seems like a reasonable rule, where do those 29
dogs go or who is policing that different activity as they take those dogs someplace else, 30
which they probably will. 31
Mr. Anderson: That's a good question. 32
Commissioner McCauley: That's a fair point. My understanding—correct me if I'm 33
wrong—is that our neighboring communities have a limit on the number of dogs that can 34
Approved Minutes 15
APPROVED
be brought to a park. Currently, commercial dog walkers who are picking up dogs in 1
Mountain View are bringing them to Palo Alto because we don't have that rule. I know 2
there are a number of commercial dog walkers that take dogs to the beach. They go to 3
Santa Cruz or they go to Fort Funston or somewhere else. They don't have a restriction 4
there, and that's a pretty popular thing for a lot of commercial dog walkers. At the 5
moment, it is important to recognize that Palo Alto is probably the place where a lot of 6 them are landing because it's close and they can't walk dogs in Mountain View or Menlo 7
Park or somewhere else with more than three per person. 8
Commissioner McDougall: Just one quick question. A number of cities have 9
implemented different versions of what you would call a pop-up dog park. They're not 10
permanent; they're in place. I wondered if the committee had considered that as one way 11
to do something quickly in more places with restrictions as to the size of the dog, the 12
number of days a week or days a month or whatever it is you do. That would be a way 13
to, if not build something specific, at least spread it out geographically. 14
Mr. Anderson: That was something we had looked at fairly intensely during the shared 15
use exploration. This was mainly in baseball, softball partially fenced off areas. We 16
said, "Can we use this for a dog park 1 or 2 days a week or more?" Unfortunately, we 17
didn't have a lot of success there. It doesn't mean we couldn't look elsewhere for other 18
opportunities. 19
Vice Chair Moss: That was my reasoning for allowing them to pay for exclusive use of 20
an existing park. I'm willing to bet that there are some quiet hours where there are fewer 21
dogs, many fewer days. I don't know what day of the week, and I don't know what hour 22
of the day. 1:00 in the afternoon on a Wednesday could be your pop-up. One of the 23
existing parks is a pop-up for commercial users for an hour or for 2 hours, and then 24
they're out of there for the rest of the week. Just something to consider. 25
Mr. Anderson: One thing that's ruminating in my head from all the outreach is, as we 26 looked at that shared use model for over a year, the outcome of that and numerous public 27 meetings with hundreds of people was we want dedicated dog parks. It doesn't mean this 28
couldn't be popular with some, but I got shouted down with that shared-use idea. It just 29
did not fly, for what it's worth. 30
Vice Chair Moss: What I meant is those dog walkers are walking Palo Alto dogs for Palo 31
Alto dog owners, not that they're bringing dogs from Cupertino over here. You are using 32
those parks to exercise Palo Alto dogs. In that respect, it is a dedicated dog park for our 33
use. 34
Chair Reckdahl: Can you even rent out the area or charge people to bring it in if it's a 35
dedicated park? Is that allowed? 36
Approved Minutes 16
APPROVED
Mr. Anderson: Much like a picnic area, I suppose it would be. It would be a challenge. 1
My hunch is it wouldn't be very popular with our regular dog walkers that aren't 2
commercial. We could certainly look into it. 3
Chair Reckdahl: I'm nervous just because we're short of dog parks, the optics of it may 4
be bad. We can investigate it. One question. You said the $150,000 was in fiscal year 5
'19? 6
Mr. Anderson: Yes. 7
Chair Reckdahl: That starts July 1 … 8
Mr. Anderson: Yes. 9
Chair Reckdahl: … '19? That means that … 10
Mr. Anderson: Actually, let me double check that. I'll get back to you on confirming 11
that funding year. 12
Chair Reckdahl: That would be July 1, so that's only a year and a half away. We have to 13
have some time, but not that much. If there are no other questions, we'll move on to the 14
next topic. 15
4. Palo Alto Swim & Sport Year End Review 16
Chair Reckdahl: Jazmin is here to talk about aquatics. Perfect timing, Tim just showed 17
up. Welcome. Thank you, Daren. 18
Ms. O'Kane: Our next item is an update on the Rinconada Pool, specifically Palo Alto 19
Swim and Sport. They have been operating the Rinconada Pool and providing swim 20
lessons since August. Overall, I feel like it's been quite successful. Included in their 21
contract is a requirement to provide a status report to the Parks and Rec Commission in 22
the fall. Today, with us is Jazmin Le Blanc, who is the Senior Manager of our Strategy 23
and Operations group within Community Services, and also Tim Sheeper, who manages 24
our Palo Alto Swim and Sport operation at Rinconada Pool. I'll turn it over to Jazmin 25 and Tim. 26
Jazmin Le Blanc: Thanks so much. This is Jazmin Le Blanc from the Community 27 Services Department. I have a very brief presentation. This is essentially a year in 28
review. As Kristen mentioned, they haven't actually been with us for a full year yet, but 29
we still have some interesting data. I will jump right in. Beginning on August 14, Team 30
Sheeper also known as Palo Alto Swim and Sport, became our aquatics operator. Prior to 31
that, they had overseen our swim lesson program since 2015. This year we expanded the 32
program to start in April, and it went from April through October. Right now, they are 33
Approved Minutes 17
APPROVED
offering swim lessons and overseeing our lap swim program and our contracts with 1
Rinconada Masters and PASA and also provided summer swim camps this summer. One 2
of the most notable differences between our old program and our new program is the 3
expanded swim lesson program. As you can see on this slide, we covered many more 4
months with swim lessons. We had two different types of swim lessons available, the 5
traditional weekly lessons where a child comes each day of the week for 1 or many weeks 6 and also the once a week swim lesson that you can take over a longer period of time. We 7
served nearly 10,000 children in 2017, which was a significant increase from previous 8
years. I put that in the memo. I can't recall off the top of my head, but several thousand 9
more students were in our swim program this year than in previous years. We had a 10
pretty good satisfaction rate with 83 percent satisfied or extremely satisfied with the 11
program. As I mentioned, we also had over 100 children participate in swim camps this 12
summer. On the lap and open swim side, we now have 125 monthly swim passholders. 13
When you do the math, that's a little bit more than we had in 10-pack users. We're 14
getting some really great consistent users of our lap swim program. We also had an 15
extended open swim season. Palo Alto Swim and Sport offers a family pass that people 16
can come up to the pool and buy. We had more than 400 families participating in 17
purchasing that during our extended period as well as some others during the month of 18
August, many more in August. On top of that, we've had about 3,000 additional 19
participants in lap and open swim since they began operating that program, which is up 20
from what it is the previous year. We were really pleased to see 95 percent satisfied or 21
extremely satisfied with the lap and open swim program for the people who did respond 22
to the survey. We have been able to do this without a change in our schedule for PASA 23
or Rinconada Masters. That concludes my presentation. If you have any questions for 24
myself or for Tim, we're happy to take them. 25
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you. We have no public comment, so we'll start. Ryan, do you 26 want to start? 27
Commissioner McCauley: Just at the outset, let me note this year is unique because you 28
only began the contract with Palo Alto Swim and Sport in August. For next year, 29
something that would be very helpful from my perspective is to see year-over-year 30
comparisons. It needs to start before Palo Alto Swim and Sport was running the pool. 31
Keep that in mind for future reports. Certainly, this is a lot of good news, but I don't have 32
a lot of context in some respects to understand a lot of these numbers. Let me ask with 33
respect to the swim lesson program, there were 17 percent of folks who filled out surveys 34
saying they were not satisfied. What are the big categories that are driving that? Are 35
there particular reasons and are there things being done to improve? 36
Tim Sheeper: It was the basic registration, the start of the registration because we did the 37
resident verification. It was a complex process that they had to go through to verify that 38
they are residents to get the subsidy. That was a majority of it as we were trying to 39
Approved Minutes 18
APPROVED
navigate that and figure that out early on. That was the most dissatisfaction that we came 1
across. 2
Ms. Le Blanc: In terms of comparisons with our previous summers, it's pretty similar to 3
what we've had in previous years. We can incorporate that in our report next year to 4
show some trends over time. 5
Chair Reckdahl: Is that verification a one-time process? Now, they're in your system, 6 and they can register easily next time or do they have to go through the same thing? 7
Mr. Sheeper: They're in the system, and they're continuing to register. Once they're 8
registered, they don't have to continue to register. All they have to do is tell us when 9
they're out. 10
Chair Reckdahl: If they, let's say, went to a summer session for a week and did lessons, 11
now if they come back next year and want to do another week, do they have to prove that 12
they're still a resident? 13
Mr. Sheeper: No. It's one shot, and they're in. 14
Commissioner Cribbs: When we started this, the really good reasons for having a 15
contract with Palo Alto was to extend the pool hours and to make sure we had adequate 16
lifeguards going all year round. In that respect, this has been very successful. I'm happy 17
to see that. Very good job on the work that you've done taking over, Tim. It's a lot of 18
moving parts and a lot of things that all the staff had to work together and solve. I do 19
have some questions. Am I reading this right that about 85 percent of people taking 20
lessons are Palo Alto residents? 21
Mr. Sheeper: On the weeklies, yes, 91 percent. You're mostly getting residents. Ninety-22
nine on the weekly privates. Overall, that's correct. 23
Commissioner Cribbs: I just want to make sure that I was clear on that. The lifeguards, 24
can you talk anecdotally about are you having trouble getting lifeguards, is it an ongoing 25 process, are a lot of the lifeguards coming from Palo Alto or no? 26
Mr. Sheeper: Our leadership team is some staff members that we've had at Menlo, who 27 have moved over to Palo Alto and have become the leadership team. We have about six 28
to eight members who are previous Palo Alto lifeguards and who are on staff, mostly 29
doing weekends and some after school work. Mostly minors, 16-18 year olds. 30
Commissioner Cribbs: How many lifeguards do you have altogether? 31
Mr. Sheeper: We probably have about 12, 12-15 lifeguards. 32
Approved Minutes 19
APPROVED
Commissioner Cribbs: The reason I'm asking is being a lifeguard at a local swimming 1
pool, as everybody knows, is a really fun job for local kids and always a really important 2
part of kids' lives. I just want to make sure that Palo Alto kids have the opportunity, if 3
they want to pursue that, to have a position. You probably would love to have them. 4
Mr. Sheeper: Absolutely. The opportunity's always there. We're always hiring. 5
Commissioner Cribbs: The next question. Could you talk a little bit about your 6 relationship with PASA and Rinconada Masters please and how it's going? I know those 7
contracts were signed a little bit later and there probably hasn't been enough time to work 8
through any potential rough spots. From your perspective, how's it going? 9
Mr. Sheeper: I don't think there's any rough spots. I think it's just like any new 10
relationship. They're getting used to this new management team, which is me and my 11
staff that's on the ground at the pool. I have a long history with Tony, 20-plus years. We 12
communicate frequently on things and issues like the closures for the air quality for the 13
fires. We had to text back and forth because those decisions had to be made quick, and 14
that affected the community and it affected his swimmers. We came to an understanding 15
of how we could communicate quickly and get things done. With Rinconada Masters, 16
they've been here 40-plus years, so they have a certain way of conducting their team and 17
conducting their operations. We're really new to the game, so it's mostly us getting used 18
to them and what their needs are and trying to weave in so that we can support them and 19
help them really flourish as a team. 20
Commissioner Cribbs: This report said that no change in the schedule for either PASA or 21
Rinconada Masters. That's pretty great that you were able to achieve that. 22
Mr. Sheeper: We want to come in and build aquatics in Palo Alto. We don't want to 23
upset aquatics in Palo Alto. That was never our intent. First, we have to stabilize what 24
we have and then build upon that. Once we've built up the trust, they have to really trust 25 what we're doing and really feel we're authentic. We want to really make aquatics very 26 strong in Palo Alto all around, just not one facet of it, from lessons to youth team to 27 Masters to water exercise, etc. 28
Commissioner Cribbs: I think this is the last question. There's always a lot of 29
maintenance around a pool that needs to be done. If I remember right, there's usually 30
maintenance at Rinconada that has to be done. That's a Public Works function. How is 31
that going? How is that communication going? 32
Mr. Sheeper: That's another new relationship as well. Public Works never had to deal 33
with outside group. We're fortunate enough that we have a long history in operating 34
pools, so we have a good understanding of the mechanical workings of it, the 35
hydrodynamics of it. We know when to reach out to them and what to tell them to help 36
Approved Minutes 20
APPROVED
them come to action when needed. Pools are big, complex systems. They have to be 1
monitored daily, 24/7. The guys on Public Works have a big job. Most of their systems 2
are on alarms, and they're connected to their mobile devices. When the systems go out of 3
their parameters, they're notified 24/7. They know what's happening. It's usually us 4
reiterating the fact that the heat needs to be adjusted or the chemistry needs to be 5
adjusted. They're always, "Yes, we know." They're right there. We're just another 6 outside source that is adding to the mixture in the relationship. Now, it's only been 3 1/2 7
months, and that is still developing. With the help of staff, we've had a couple of 8
meetings with them to sort of how we deal with bigger issues once they start to happen. 9
We haven't experienced a full summer, and that's when you have the most impact on the 10
pool. That's when we're going to really have to make sure that the pools are in the 11
parameters that we need for safety. 12
Commissioner Cribbs: Just to say that Rinconada is a terrific resource for the 13
community. Everybody loves it. I'm glad to see it being used, and I'm glad we have 14
lifeguards so we don't have to put the sign on the pool that says we're closed. Thank you 15
very much for all the answers to the questions, Tim. Appreciate it. 16
Mr. Sheeper: You're quite welcome. 17
Chair Reckdahl: I want to follow-up on the maintenance issue. For example, every day 18
they check the chlorine and make sure that's okay. The person who did that a year ago, is 19
that the same person that's doing it now or was there a switch over on the responsibilities 20
of the … 21
Mr. Sheeper: It's the same person. What we've added is—they have full-time staff that 22
take care of that and spend hours at the pool daily. What we do is spot checks. When we 23
open the pool and we're letting our programs in, we check the pool to make sure that it's 24
within Code to open it, that it has the right chlorine balance and the right pH balance, and 25 the temperature's on. We make those three basic checks. A majority of the time it's spot 26 on. When it's off, we have to either make a call or add something. It's very … 27
Chair Reckdahl: Do you have the ability to modify the chemistry yourself? 28
Mr. Sheeper: No, no. 29
Chair Reckdahl: They have to come in? 30
Mr. Sheeper: Yes, just if there's—we're working on this. If there's an accidental fecal 31
accident, there are certain protocols that we have to follow by County Code to make sure 32
that we can continue operating the pool once there's a short closure period. We want to 33
be able to do that. Public Works is in agreement with us that it's a simple process that we 34
Approved Minutes 21
APPROVED
can follow. We're working through that, and that's going to happen on a weekly basis 1
during the summertime. 2
Chair Reckdahl: When there have been issues and you contact Public Works, have they 3
been responsive? 4
Mr. Sheeper: Yes, yes. They hear from us quite often. Pools are like boats, they just 5
need constant attention. 6
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you. 7
Vice Chair Moss: I have just a couple of quick ones. The lap swimmers, I thought there 8
were only like 70, and now there's 150. That's a huge jump in lap swimmers and adult 9
swim. Isn't that the case? 10
Ms. Le Blanc: Are you referring to our regulars who are coming into the pool? 11
Vice Chair Moss: Yeah. 12
Ms. Le Blanc: It depends on how you tease out who's a regular. Before I put together the 13
cover memo for this, I went back and took a look at our 2016 data for people who came 14
in with a 10-pack six or more times a month to try to figure out would those be our likely 15
monthly passholders if we had offered it under our operations. When I did that, it was 16
around 100, 110 depending on the month. It wasn't as low as 70, but it certainly is higher 17
with Palo Alto Swim and Sport. 18
Vice Chair Moss: One hundred and fifty is great. The second question I had is for the 19
swim school. Are you at the max now? I noticed that the volumes—at the most, you had 20
860 lessons in August and 720 in September and 660 in October for residents. I noticed 21
as the season the went on, the nonresident percentage went up. It was maybe because of 22
the start-up issues, but I don't know for sure. Do you see that trend continuing? How 23
many more are you going to be able to get above and beyond 860 lessons? Will they be 24
nonresidents or residents? 25
Mr. Sheeper: They're going to mostly be residents. That's what we as using Rinconada 26 Pool, mostly residents. Yes, there's room for plenty more lessons. We're nowhere near 27 capacity. 28
Vice Chair Moss: Have you been successful in—if the demand is really high in August, 29
have you been successful in getting people to come in September and October instead of 30
everybody piling on in August? 31
Mr. Sheeper: They're mostly going to pile on in the summertime because it's the nicest 32
time to learn how to swim. It's warm, and people have the time, so they're going to come 33
Approved Minutes 22
APPROVED
during those 8-10 weeks when school is not in. The intent is to build a year-round or 1
mostly year-round school starting all the way in the beginning of spring and running 2
through the end of fall. You think of daylight hours and running a school for that period 3
of time. It'll swell during the summer months. 4
Vice Chair Moss: I guess my question was how do you increase the number on the 5
fringes, September and May and then November. How will that happen? 6
Mr. Sheeper: That's going to happen over time, once people know that we're here and 7
they know the quality that we can deliver to them and the services that are there. It's just 8
going to take some time, some outreach. With swim lessons, it's going to be word of 9
mouth. With all the marketing or advertising we do and the information that we get back 10
through our surveys, it's mostly word of mouth. 11
Vice Chair Moss: I suspect that next year in October and November, if the weather is 12
anything like this year, you're going to get a higher volume. If it goes back to normal, 13
will weather play a role in how many people show up in October and November? 14
Mr. Sheeper: Not really. The number of people that we had at the end of summer, mid-15
August to the numbers that we had on October 29th, the end of our season, was about the 16
same. It really didn't fluctuate. People get in the rhythm. If they get a good connection 17
with their instructor and the child is making progress, the parent will come. It's a service 18
that they (crosstalk). 19
Vice Chair Moss: Even if it's cold, even if it's seasonally cold. What about Terman and 20
JLS pools? You couldn't use them this year. Are you intending to expand to those pools 21
in the future? 22
Ms. Le Blanc: It's something we want to keep on the table, but we need to have another 23
discussion. We have regular, big meetings quarterly. Our next one is going to be in 24
January, and that's when we would want to discuss with Tim if that's something he would 25 want to take on. If so, we need to start figuring out what we might ask for in terms of 26 schedule, location, etc., to see if we can make it all work out. 27
Vice Chair Moss: My last question. My neighborhood pool is the Greenmeadow pool, 28
and it's closed for a year, maybe more. They had lots of lessons, and they had lots of 29
adult swimmers, and they had lots of swim teams. I think some of that's going to go to 30
the Eichler pool, but I'm wondering how much of that is going to you. You haven't heard 31
anything about that or … 32
Mr. Sheeper: This is the first I'm hearing of it. Maybe it's an opportunity for the 33
Rinconada Pool. 34
Approved Minutes 23
APPROVED
Vice Chair Moss: There's a Greenmeadow bulletin and all that kind of stuff. That's all I 1
had. 2
Commissioner LaMere: In terms of the revenue and number of lessons and people that 3
came through, I know it was going to be hard to project, where does it fall with your 4
expectations of what you thought the first summer would look like? 5
Mr. Sheeper: About the number of lessons coming through? 6
Commissioner LaMere: As well as the revenue. 7
Mr. Sheeper: Attached to the revenue. Moderate. I thought we were going to do better. 8
I'm an eternal optimist, so I thought there was going to be more people coming through. I 9
do know that it does take time for people to adopt the new service. They have to find out 10
is it worthy of them spending the time and energy and resources to come to the program. 11
Commissioner LaMere: Now that winter is approaching, I take it we're stopping lessons. 12
That's correct at Rinconada? 13
Mr. Sheeper: Correct. 14
Commissioner LaMere: What's the role now for you with the pool? It's to oversee PASA 15
and the Masters and the pool in general or are there other opportunities for you during the 16
winter months with the pool? 17
Mr. Sheeper: Right now, we are just overseeing PASA, Rinconada Masters, and lap 18
swim. We are beginning our planning for 2018 and hoping to start some new programs 19
in the springtime. It really doesn't make that much sense to start them in January, 20
February, March; it's hard to get any traction. We have to pause and wait until we get 21
some warmth. 22
Commissioner LaMere: Thanks. 23
Commissioner Greenfield: Most of my questions have already been asked by other 24
Commissioners. I do support Ryan's comment about the value of year-over-year 25 comparisons. That's highly desirable. Related to that, regarding lifeguard hires, do we 26 have a number of how many Palo Alto youth were hired this summer versus the previous 27 summer? 28
Ms. Le Blanc: In terms of the program before August, before Team Sheeper began 29
operating or after? 30
Commissioner Greenfield: Sure. 31
Approved Minutes 24
APPROVED
Ms. Le Blanc: Before, I think it was mostly Palo Alto youth, and there were 1
approximately 50 employees on staff as seasonal hires. 2
Commissioner Greenfield: I'm sorry. There was 50 or 15? 3
Ms. Le Blanc: Fifty, 5-0, because summer is such a big time. They came in when we 4
shifted into our fall schedule. Their first day was the first day of school in Palo Alto. 5
They have a much smaller staff because of that, but they'll ramp up in the summer. We 6 did really push the opportunity to all of the employees that were there during the summer. 7
Tim and his staff came to many of their weekly staff meetings to promote. They did 8
onsite interviews, really tried to make sure that anyone who was interested knew that they 9
had the opportunity and made it as easy as possible to partake in that. As we noticed in 10
the past, most of our employees weren't really interested in participating and working 11
during the school year. They encountered the same problem that we encountered in 12
terms of keeping on local Palo Alto teenagers for their school year time period. 13
Commissioner Greenfield: I think the answer is, for a true apples-to-apples comparison, 14
we need to wait until next September and count the numbers then. 15
Ms. Le Blanc: I think so. 16
Commissioner Greenfield: It looks like the ratio of group to private lessons is roughly 17
80/20. Has that changed over time? Is that what we were seeing in 2016 as well? 18
Ms. Le Blanc: That's my recollection. I do apologize for not having hard statistics. I can 19
tell you that we haven't wanted to offer tons of private lessons in the past because we're 20
only serving one resident as opposed to four in a group lesson. They are popular and 21
usually sell out in their availability. 22
Commissioner Greenfield: That's really the gist of my question. Is the number of private 23
lessons roughly consistent with what it has been relative to the number of hours available 24
for lessons? 25
Chair Reckdahl: When you say sell out, that means you run out of instructors or you run 26 out of lanes? What's the limiting factor? 27
Mr. Sheeper: Instructors. 28
Commissioner Greenfield: Final question. Regarding the overall impact to the City 29
financially, are we where we expected to be? Is this more expensive or less expensive for 30
the City? 31
Ms. Le Blanc: This year, we did have the capacity to offer about 18,000 lessons. That 32
was the most costly part of this program. In terms of the cost to the City, it actually is a 33
Approved Minutes 25
APPROVED
little bit less than expected for this year. However, we do want to see more participants. 1
I hope that we get higher next year. As you all may recall, we don't have a subsidy built 2
into next year's program. We negotiated to keep the rate pretty similar to what we've 3
been offering for residents without a subsidy. Next year, we want to see as many people 4
participating as possible. I anticipate if we stay on track with where we are, we'll be 5
probably a little bit below what I would have told you guys about 9 months ago in terms 6 of revenue, but not hugely below that. 7
Commissioner Greenfield: Can you refresh my memory please? There were subsidies 8
offered this year. Are subsidies not being offered next year, so the rates will be increased 9
next year? 10
Ms. Le Blanc: The rates may go up a little bit. We have to negotiate that with Tim. We 11
did negotiate so that our subsidized rate—I think it was $16 for a group lesson—would 12
remain $16 or perhaps $16-plus, $17, something like that and not jump up to our full cost 13
of $20 a lesson. I see puzzled looks. I'm sorry. 14
Commissioner Greenfield: Does that mean the City will continue to pay subsidies next 15
year? 16
Ms. Le Blanc: No. We negotiated with Tim that he would offer the lesson at $16 or 17
possibly $17 without a subsidy. He is going to be earning less on each of those lessons, 18
but he also is operating the full program and hopefully will be able to grow the program. 19
It made sense to him and to the City. 20
Commissioner Greenfield: Thank you for the clarification. 21
Commissioner McDougall: I think there's been an awful lot of talk about the data and 22
comparing year-to-year. Jazmin, I want to compliment you on your facility with the 23
numbers. I'm really pleased with that. I'd like to encourage both you and Team Sheeper 24
to be more curious about the numbers and analyze them—I think you can do that—and 25 also more specific. My only disappointment in this whole thing was you said several 26 hundred more people dropped into the pool over and above least year. If several hundred 27 is 200, then that's 10 or 12 percent. If several hundred is 400, that's 35 or 40 percent. 28
The difference between those two is big in terms of is it really successful or is it 29
marginally successful. I want to compliment you and encourage you and to anticipate 30
what kind of numbers, not just … 31
Ms. Le Blanc: Thank you. I really appreciate how astute this Commission is. I had 32
hoped I could sneak that by because, just to be frank, we didn't offer a family entrance fee 33
in the past. The family could be two, three, four, or five people coming in at once. We 34
always had each individual pay for themselves. I didn't want to give a hard number 35
Approved Minutes 26
APPROVED
because we don't know precisely how many people actually entered the pool when he is 1
selling family tickets. I made an estimate. 2
Commissioner McDougall: Being curious means thinking ahead of time about what this 3
curious body might ask you and, therefore, not ending up a year from now saying, "We 4
forgot to collect that piece of data." 5
Ms. Le Blanc: I want to say that when I made the assumption that the average family 6 entering was four people, then it was approximately 800 more coming in. 7
Commissioner Greenfield: Just following up. Would it be possible to track the number 8
of people that actually enter the pool? When someone comes in on a family pass, we do 9
a separate count for each person. 10
Mr. Sheeper: We are doing that. The point is that we offered a new way to enter the pool 11
that they didn't have last year. Our philosophy was to bring families in, to give them a 12
low rate to bring the whole family in. Before, it was just individual passes. Next year's 13
going to be all new data as well because there's nothing to compare that to. We do track 14
the numbers. 15
Chair Reckdahl: If a family comes in, they have a card and they scan it. You let the 16
whole family in. Do you count how many people on in the card or you just let the whole 17
family go in? 18
Mr. Sheeper: The people who are coming in for the open swim, it's usually a cash 19
payment. It's one time. It's a whole family coming in, and we count, and then it's $15. 20
Chair Reckdahl: Do you remember … 21
Mr. Sheeper: It could be three people, it could be four, it could be five people. 22
Chair Reckdahl: Do you count that down or do you just count them at the time and then 23
let them go, but you don't (crosstalk). 24
Mr. Sheeper: We key it into our system that says family pass or family entrance. We 25 know how many have come in. 26
Chair Reckdahl: We should have Don's numbers. It's just we haven't … 27
Ms. Le Blanc: I think what they're asking is if a family of three comes in, do you mark 28
that it was three people? 29
Mr. Sheeper: No, no. It's just marked as one. 30
Approved Minutes 27
APPROVED
Commissioner Greenfield: That's what I was asking if we could count. 1
Mr. Sheeper: Excuse me. Yes. 2
Commissioner Greenfield: Can we count that? 3
Ms. Le Blanc: In terms of the pricing, where it would make sense for people to choose 4
the family pass, it's going to be most likely four or five people. We could make some 5
assumptions. That's probably the right way to do it in the future. 6
Chair Reckdahl: It'd be nice to know, but I don't want to waste labor on that. Is that it? 7
Back to the fecal incident. We have the two pools. Do they have common filtration? 8
Mr. Sheeper; No, they're separate. 9
Chair Reckdahl: If there's a fecal incident in one, you can hop in the other. 10
Mr. Sheeper: Correct. 11
Chair Reckdahl: How long is that outage usually? 12
Mr. Sheeper: It depends on what style. It could be 30 minutes, or it could be over 20 13
hours. 14
Chair Reckdahl: That's if the action starts right now, it might be 30 minutes or 20 15
minutes. 16
Mr. Sheeper: We have a protocol, and the guards know how to react. It's usually right on 17
30 minutes. 18
Chair Reckdahl: Right now, you have to call Public Works, and they have to come over 19
and do something. 20
Mr. Sheeper: No, we're working through that. That's a no. We can handle it onsite and 21
take care of it and just record it and do the chemistry, which is adding chlorine. 22
Chair Reckdahl: For open swim, how often are we at capacity at the pool or is it 23
(crosstalk). 24
Mr. Sheeper: We started on the 14th of August, at the end of summer. We reached 25 capacity quite quickly. It was a new thing to us. People will line up anywhere from 30-26 60 minutes ahead of time and just sit on their coolers and hang out and wait so that they 27 can get their spot. Once they're in the pool, they'll stay for the entire time. 28
Chair Reckdahl: You keep a count then and you say no one enters and then … 29
Approved Minutes 28
APPROVED
Mr. Sheeper: One guard can guard 25 participants. We would put 5-6 guards on the play 1
pool, and we'd also open up some sections of the performance pool and put people there. 2
Usually we'd have 11-12 guards on the pools. We would reach capacity. For us, it wasn't 3
necessarily weather dependent because it could be warm. After a certain time—after 4
Labor Day it was still warm, but the usage dropped pretty dramatically. People just 5
moved on to other things. 6
Chair Reckdahl: We talked about the junior high pools. Jordan last year, we did not use 7
them. That was because we didn't get enough registrations? 8
Ms. Le Blanc: That's right. 9
Chair Reckdahl: This year when we decide whether we want one of these pools, we're 10
going to wait 'til after registration and then look at the demand or how are we going to 11
work that? When does that decision have to be made? 12
Ms. Le Blanc: We need to make that decision before Tim's group starts to really ramp up 13
and tries to promote their swim lessons. We probably wouldn't want to wait until after 14
people register because they won't know necessarily. We might want to do something 15
similar where we try to negotiate and get the pool, make sure it's available, and then see 16
what kind of demand there is. We could see if we could potentially drop lanes or drop 17
times if we don't get the demand. 18
Chair Reckdahl: How do we choose between Jordan and JLS and Terman? 19
Ms. O'Kane: I think one of the reasons last year why enrollment in the satellite pool was 20
low is that it's typically at JLS, which is further from Rinconada. With Jordan being just 21
down the road from Rinconada, it may not have made sense for people to go there as 22
opposed to just go to Rinconada. Typically, JLS is the pool that's offered to us from the 23
School District, so that would b the one that we would likely go to. It wasn't available 24
last year because of maintenance, which they ended up not doing. The pool did become 25 available to us, but by then it was so close to summer starting that it would have been 26 difficult to shift all of the communication to the public that it was back at JLS. If we do 27 decide to do a satellite pool, I think it's most successful if it's in another location in south 28
Palo Alto so people have the option to go somewhere that's close to them. Like Jazmin 29
said, we'll assess that next year. We'll see which pools are available and if it's something 30
we want to pursue. 31
Vice Chair Moss: Just one thing on that. The Greenmeadow pool is closed because 32
they're rebuilding it after 30 years. That's the closest one; that's about 3 blocks from JLS. 33
I would encourage you to reach out to that community and see what you can do for their 34
lessons. 35
Approved Minutes 29
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: I think Greenmeadow is supposed to open in May. We'll find out. We 1
can cross that bridge when we get to it. Last question for Tim. What can we do for you? 2
You have this new home now. You're taking control of the pool. Are there things about 3
the pool that you don't like? The pool complex, not necessarily the pool itself. How are 4
the locker rooms? How are the meeting rooms, the other parts of the facility? Does it 5
meet all your needs? 6
Mr. Sheeper: The pool is in an idyllic setting. It's surrounded by a beautiful park and 7
trees. It has this iconic past with lap swimmers and the Master swimmers and a very 8
powerful national youth swim team there. The way the Commission could support that 9
pool is to learn how it's used. I've been around this area for a long time. When I started 10
operating it, I was very surprised of how it was actually used. I had my assumptions, but 11
then when I was actually there on the ground and guarding, I was surprised of who 12
actually comes to lap swimming, who actually comes to open swimming. It was 13
completely different than what I thought it would be. It's good for the Commission on a 14
weekend day in the summer to see who is coming to the pool if you haven't already. It 15
was surprising to me. With that, you'd have a real clear picture of what we're dealing 16
with. The pool is old, but it's been refurbished, recycled. It's sturdy, so it's going to last 17
us a long time. We've been talking about minor upgrades just to bring a little bit more 18
pizazz and pop to the play pool. Maybe clean a little thing, polish a little thing there. 19
That's something we want to get to. It's been run one way for a very, very long time. As 20
a new operator coming in, I'm real sensitive to that. My goal is not to do anything too 21
fast, just to slowly make an impact but impact slowly. That's going to be the way we're 22
most accepted from this community. 23
Vice Chair Moss: One quick question. A long time ago, about a year ago, we talked 24
about making the pool longer, 25 meters or 25 years. Those plans are not—you're good 25 for 10 years. Is that right? 26
Mr. Sheeper: In this area, if you build a bigger pool, it will fill up. In this area, if you 27 build it, they will come. It's just a matter of what the City wants to get into. 28
Chair Reckdahl: If we had a bigger pool or a second pool, do we have the lifeguard 29
capability? It seems like that's the limitation. 30
Mr. Sheeper: That is a challenge, yes. The challenge that's attached to that right now, 31
that we're experiencing, is that the pool is open for a certain amount of time, and then it's 32
closed. This is all in the same day. It's open, it's closed, it's open, and it's closed. There 33
are three lifeguard shifts that have to be filled instead of one or two 8-hour shifts so 34
people can work a full day and get paid their 8 hours. We're dealing with that. As the 35
model changes, it's much more likely to get more full-time staff who are committed to an 36
aquatics career. 37
Approved Minutes 30
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: Any other … Ryan. 1
Commissioner McCauley: Reviewing the report in advance of the meeting, I thought it 2
reflected all very positive and good news. Through tonight's discussion, it seems as 3
though a couple of areas are actually coming in lower, for example on the revenue share 4
component of it. Is that right? We're below where we expected to be? 5
Ms. Le Blanc; Yes, because we didn't have as many lessons as we had hoped we would 6 have and camps. In addition to what Tim mentioned for the registration being somewhat 7
onerous and people not liking that, we've worked with his staff to try to smooth the 8
resident registration process so new people who want to come to the pool don't face the 9
same challenges that some of the first program participants faced. We also had far fewer 10
summer camp participants than we anticipated. We have talked a lot about what we can 11
do there. It was not in the Enjoy! catalog with all the other camps that the City offers. It 12
was in there but in the back, far behind the rest of the City camps. People, from my 13
experience as a parent who signs up for camps, didn't even realize we had swim camps 14
available this summer. We're trying to make some tweaks to just get people to know that 15
we're offering these programs. City staff and Tim's staff feel confident that we can grow 16
the program to what we had expected, but it didn't hit the numbers this year. 17
Commissioner McCauley: I completely agree with Don's comment that your facility with 18
the numbers is excellent. Something that would be helpful from my perspective, 19
appreciating that this is a report prepared by Team Sheeper—Team Sheeper obviously 20
wants to put its best foot forward, totally understandable—I don't know if it's an interim 21
report before next fall or whenever you think the next period when you actually have a 22
good comparison year-over-year, it'd be good to have a robust report from the City that 23
gives us that sort of information. 24
Ms. Le Blanc: I think we could certainly do that. Maybe it's something that we present 25 in advance of the summer, some of the issues that we've been trying to work through with 26 Tim and what we anticipate we might see over the summer. As Tim mentioned, we do 27 have some facility enhancements that we hope we can find some funding for this year. 28
For example, the water features that are in the play pool, we'd like to be able to fix. We 29
have some broken features. The slide is on its last legs, for example. There's lots going 30
on with the pool. 31
Commissioner McCauley: Let me just add that it's kind of the universal sentiment that 32
things are going well. It just would be great to have the solid numbers to digest. Enough 33
from me on that. 34
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you, Tim. Thank you, Jazmin. We appreciate it. 35
Ms. O'Kane: Could I add just some final comments? 36
Approved Minutes 31
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: Sure. 1
Ms. O'Kane: First, if there are specific data points that haven't been brought up tonight 2
and you would like us to look at or report on, if you could let me or Jazmin know so that 3
we're providing the information that you're really interested. Second, I just wanted to 4
mention or point out that Team Sheeper has done a really good job of communicating. 5
It's new for everyone to have them there. It's new for us. It's new for Masters, for the 6 parents who are taking their kids to swim lessons. We're all getting used to it, and we're 7
getting to know each other. They have done an excellent job of communicating and 8
being willing to communicate and work through little hiccups. An example is our 9
facilities department who has been responsible for maintaining the pool. Now, how does 10
Tim and his group fit in and how can they work together to make it as efficient as 11
possible. We get everyone at the table, and we talk through those. We say you'll do this, 12
you'll do this, and we'll follow up and make sure it's working okay. The City staff as well 13
as Tim's staff has been really great at that. We'll continue to do that. We'll make some 14
changes like Jazmin said about putting the swim camps with the rest of the camps in the 15
Enjoy! catalog to get the word out. Also, word of mouth is really going to help. Once 16
people know my kids can take swim lessons in the spring and through the fall, those 17
enrollment numbers will continue to increase. I think we're really hopeful that we're 18
headed in the right direction. 19
Vice Chair Moss: I want to make one comment. The way you handled the negotiations 20
with PASA and the adult swimmers and the Masters swim was just fantastic. It really is a 21
model. I hope you use it for the tennis players and the pickleballers and things like that. 22
Now, to hear about your negotiations with the facilities people, that's even above and 23
beyond. It's really wonderful to see. 24
Mr. Sheeper: Thanks. 25
Chair Reckdahl: What is the duration of the PASA and the Master contracts that we 26 signed? How long—is it a year, 2 years? 27
Mr. Sheeper: It's to the end of '18. 28
Ms. Le Blanc: We will be issuing a new RFP in the spring because this expires 29
December 31, 2018. We could definitely use more insight from this Commission if there 30
are data points or other things that you would like us to look at in preparation for that as 31
well. 32
Chair Reckdahl: Once that's awarded, we have to negotiate with PASA and Masters 33
again. 34
Approved Minutes 32
APPROVED
Ms. Le Blanc: Yes. Ideally, we would negotiate with them during that process and not 1
wait until after we have made an award. 2
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you. We'll move on. 3
5. Update on Youth and Teen Programs 4
Chair Reckdahl: The next item is youth and teen programs. Adam Howard is here. 5
Ms. O'Kane: This item one that was requested by the Commission just to come back and 6 give an update on our youth and teen programs that we offer the community. I asked 7
Tyler Stetson, who some of you may know as being previously in our aquatics program 8
and is now our Coordinator of youth and teen programs out of Mitchell Park Community 9
Center. I've asked Tyler to come and give a presentation, an update on our youth and 10
teen programs. Along side him is Adam Howard who is manages the Mitchell Park 11
Community Center and lots of other things that go on there. I'll turn it over to Tyler. 12
Tyler Stetson: Thank you, Kristen, and thank you to the Commission for giving us the 13
opportunity to meet with you tonight to talk about our youth and teen programs. First, I'll 14
give you just the background about the teen programs. The City of Palo Alto recognizes 15
the importance of creating a positive and safe environment where teens can develop life 16
skills and grow as individuals. The Community Services Department offers several 17
programs focusing on developing the spirit, mind and body, stimulating creativity, 18
offering challenges and building developmental assets. First, I'd like to talk about our 19
teen leadership groups. With the teen leadership groups we have several within the City 20
of Palo Alto. Each teen leadership group focuses on empowering teens by providing 21
them the tools, resources and support to take the lead in meeting teen needs within the 22
community. Some of the teen leadership groups include the Palo Alto Youth Council, 23
PAYC; the Teen Advisory Board, which is the one that I personally oversee. There's the 24
Teen Arts Council or TAC as well as the Teen Library Advisory Board, T-LAB. Within 25 the teen leadership groups, we've been seeing a diverse population amongst teens within 26 Palo Alto. While we do have a primary group of Paly and Gunn students, we have seen 27 additional involvement from private schools including Castilleja and Middle College. 28
That's something we're eager to continue growing over the years. Next, I'd like to talk 29
about our Teen Center, also known as the Drop, over at the Mitchell Park Center. The 30
Teen Center provides a fun, safe, and engaging space for middle school and high school 31
students in the Palo Alto community. Primarily it offers afterschool programming for 32
middle school students as well as special events for high school students put on through 33
the various teen leadership groups. Our LEAP, Learning Enrichment After-School 34
Program, is a middle-school-focused program. The goal of LEAP is to ensure that youth 35
are provided a space, resources, support, and opportunities to be empowered and thrive 36
within their schools, homes, and communities. We'd like to point out some figures for 37
LEAP. Enrollment has seen a 66 percent increase since last year. In the fall of 2016, we 38
Approved Minutes 33
APPROVED
had 105 participants enrolled in the LEAP program. As of fall 2017, we've seen 175 1
participants enrolled. As I mentioned, LEAP is a drop-in program after school with 2
approximately 35-45 participants each day. Program activities are built around 3
participants' interests, and that include activities of art, music, sports, skill workshops, 4
games, and so on. Next, I'll be discussing our Think Fund program. This is formally 5
known as the Bryant Street Garage Fund and is overseen by Jose Perez Sanchez, who 6 works at the Mitchell Park Center. The Think Fund brings mentorship, support, 7
resources, and funding to teen-led ideas. With support from teen services throughout the 8
process, Think Fund supports teen ideas from beginning to end. Some of the things that 9
they've supported over the years include documentaries. Last year, there were a couple of 10
documentaries including Tug of War and Unmasked documentary. They also support 11
groups such as Project Anybody and Students United Against Cancer. In fiscal year '17, 12
Think Fund funded 20 teen-inspired and led projects totaling $23,000. It served 13
approximately 1,600 teens. Last May, we hosted our second annual Think Fund Gala, 14
which honors the accomplishments and awards from those Think Fund programs. Next 15
we're going to talk about summer camps. This is an introductory video. [Video shown.] 16
With our summer camps, we'll start with our Camp Palo Alto for preschoolers. This is 17
for kids age 3-4. We have our three Foothills camps including Fun Camp ages 5-7, Day 18
Camp ages 8-10, and Adventure Camp ages 11-13. In addition to that, we offer teen 19
camps, and this includes our Teen Week Out, which is for ages 13-17. We also have our 20
Counselor In Training program. This past summer we hired 38 seasonal employees, and 21
that includes two of our camp coordinators, seven of our site directors, eight of our 22
assistant site directors, and 21 camp counselors. The number of participants for the 23
camps totaled 656, and we brought in revenue of over $280,000. Our Teen Week Out 24
camp is a newer camp that was a direct response for the age group as there was a desire 25 for more opportunities for that age group. We had seven sessions throughout the 26 summer. The number of participants was about 56. Some of the camp things included 27 California beaches, visiting various beaches, as well has hiking trails, amusement parks, 28
aquatic centers, and other outdoor activities. 29
Chair Reckdahl: That's just 1 week long? 30
Mr. Stetson: Yes. With our Counselor In Training program, we look at this as the future 31
leaders of the program. It's a program that provides opportunities for teens aged 13-14 to 32
be part of the summer camps and gain valuable work experience. All CIT participants 33
applied to be part of the program and participate at our in-service week, which is the 34
week after the Palo Alto Unified School District ends their academic year. This past 35
summer, we had 45 CITs. That is our presentation. If there are any questions. 36
Chair Reckdahl: Don, do you want to start? 37
Approved Minutes 34
APPROVED
Commissioner McDougall: The presentation that we were handed out tonight is different 1
than the one we got in the mail. 2
Mr. Stetson: How so? 3
Commissioner McDougall: I think there are some pages missing. Either way, I'm really 4
enthusiastic about everything we do with teens. There needs to be some reference to the 5
teen wellness programs that are part of the City. I didn't really see that. The other thing I 6 tried to do is create myself a little table because each of these individual pages—I had to 7
look at LEAP. LEAP is for middle school. It looked to me like I would give LEAP an 8
A+ for what it's doing. I looked at Think, and Think was for high school, I think. The 9
way I interpreted what we were sent, I would say it got a B. The way we were presented 10
the data, I don't think the differentiation in the camps was in there. Camps in general 11
sounds like they get an A, but I'm not sure that's true for all of them. The teen CIT 12
program, I got back to giving that a B and then the Teen Week Out, looking at that I gave 13
it a C. I have no idea if I'm necessarily right, but there was a lack of organization 14
understanding of what it is each of these programs are trying to do and also what the 15
programs are trying to do in relationship to, for example, the library program. The 16
Library's got teens. You've got the Drop program, but right beside it you've got the 17
Library program. I'm enthusiastic about this. I'm not sure that I'm asking a question as 18
opposed to just making an observation. I'd like to see more clarity in helping us 19
understand what's really going on. The question that the Chair asked a while back is 20
what can we do to help. It's not presented in a way that allows me to say I know what to 21
push for here to help. Not a question, a comment. Thank you. 22
Mr. Stetson: Thank you. 23
Chair Reckdahl: Was there anything specific on the areas that got the worse grades that 24
made you think they had lower grades? Was it just a nebulous feeling? 25
Commissioner McDougall: There's just not enough data. There was a nebulous feeling 26 the way it was presented. 27
Commissioner Greenfield: I think it's a nice overview to give us more information about 28
what's going on. It's more qualitative than quantitative. I think it's useful in that vein. I 29
do have a question regarding the Mitchell Park Teen Center. Is this available for teens to 30
drop in every day? Is there a fee associated with this? How does that work? I have 31
looked through the window when it's been closed and thought, "That looks pretty cool in 32
there." 33
Mr. Stetson: Good question. The Teen Center is a drop-in program, afterschool for 34
middle school students. That's what we call LEAP. Our hours of operation are Monday 35
through Friday from 3:00 to 6:00 with an hour extension on Wednesdays as the schools 36
Approved Minutes 35
APPROVED
get out 1 hour earlier. That's currently our main program for LEAP. We are looking for 1
opportunities to expand programming to high school students. In the past, we've had 2
trouble in terms of getting enough high school students to keep it open after hours for that 3
population as well as on weekends. That's something that we're interested in looking into 4
to expand the program and opportunities. 5
Commissioner Greenfield: Is it free for the middle schoolers to drop in? 6
Mr. Stetson: It is. 7
Commissioner Greenfield: Thank you. 8
Chair Reckdahl: Wasn't it closed during the summer? 9
Mr. Stetson: It was closed during the summer. The reason for that is we actually host 10
our pre- and post-camp during the summer months in that space. That's the primary 11
reason for why it's been closed. We do want to look at additional opportunities where if 12
there is big enough interest in having additional programming out of there. As of this 13
past summer, that was our home base for our pre- and post-camp for summer camps. 14
Chair Reckdahl: Especially for high schoolers, they're so busy during the year and get 15
more time during the summer. That would be a time we'd want to look into expanding. 16
Commissioner LaMere: Appreciate the report. I would be interested in some of the 17
numbers for the teen leadership program in terms of participation, the Palo Alto Youth 18
Council, etc. One question I have is what's your method of attracting the participants. 19
Are you guys able to get into schools to provide literature or is it just through websites an 20
word of mouth? Is it through advertisement and posting at the library? What's the 21
method to reach these audience? 22
Mr. Stetson: Although newer to my position, I'm identifying what methods have been 23
used in the past. To my understanding for this past academic year, they began 24
recruitment in May by reaching out to the various schools, not only Paly and Gunn but 25 the additional private schools including Castilleja, Middle College, and using various 26 methods including social media, word of mouth from the current members of the past 27 year, and also promoting it through our internal catalog, Enjoy! In terms of participation 28
numbers, I can speak on PAYC and TAB. For PAYC, we have about 20 members this 29
year, again a mixture of Palo Alto High School, Gunn, and Castilleja. For the Teen 30
Advisory Board, which I oversee, we have 15 members for that. 31
Commissioner LaMere: As far as LEAP goes, is that something that also is information 32
provided to the elementary schools so that students and parents are able to learn about 33
this? 34
Approved Minutes 36
APPROVED
Mr. Stetson: For outgoing elementary school students? 1
Commissioner LaMere: LEAP is for what age? 2
Mr. Stetson: For the middle school students. 3
Commissioner LaMere: That would be sixth … 4
Mr. Stetson: Jordan. 5
Commissioner LaMere: Sixth, seventh, and eighth graders. 6
Mr. Stetson: Correct. 7
Commissioner LaMere: There's literature going to the students or the parents or … 8
Mr. Stetson: Correct. To the students also to the parents. We do notice that a large 9
number of our participants are from JLS Middle School due to its close proximity to the 10
Teen Center. However, we are trying to look at bicycle routes as well as bus 11
transportation for students at Jordan Middle School and Terman to get their participation 12
as well. 13
Commissioner LaMere: Thank you. 14
Vice Chair Moss: I really appreciate what you did with the LEAP program to tell us how 15
many were there in 2016 versus 2017 so we could make a comparison. That comparison 16
is fantastic, a 66 percent increase. What do you attribute that to? What did you do to 17
make that happen? 18
Mr. Stetson: In the start of the fall 2016 year, our previous Teen Center Director left the 19
program, so the ones running it were short-staffed and didn't have as many resources to 20
promote the program and to ensure we were promoting it properly and getting the 21
numbers that we needed. At the start of this year, we have our new Teen Center Director, 22
Emily Butterly. She joined our program back in April. Throughout the summer and 23
leading up to the fall, she's been able to help us with advertising it and getting it out to the 24
various schools so that the students and the parents were aware. 25
Vice Chair Moss: That's great. As far as the summer camps are concerned, it would be 26 nice to see the numbers from 2016 versus 2017 for the next time. Having the summer 27 camp 656 participants, is that capacity or could you handle a lot more? What was that 28
like? 29
Mr. Stetson: We could handle more. One of the challenges we face is managing our wait 30
lists. If there are any times where a participants have to drop out due to illnesses or 31
Approved Minutes 37
APPROVED
medical leaves, then that does create an opportunity where we can bring in another 1
person. Something that we're really eager to work on for this upcoming summer is 2
tracking those wait lists. If there are any openings, we can immediately contact the next 3
person on the wait list to let them know and hopefully get their registration for it. There's 4
definitely an opportunity to grow the program, but we were happy with the numbers we 5
received from this past summer. 6
Vice Chair Moss: The wait list, is it because you don't have as much staff as you would 7
like? 8
Adam Howard: Good evening. Adam Howard, CSD Manager. It depends on the camp 9
we're talking about. Some of it is transportation. We're going up on a bus, so we're 10
capped at 55. We may get more kids there. Other is we can only have as many kids as 11
we have staff. It depends on the situation and the camp. Ultimately, the better we 12
manage that, the more participants. Like he said, some of it is you're on one wait list, we 13
know there's space in another, we've got to advertise to those students that there's a 14
different option. Maybe not Option A, but there is Option B. 15
Vice Chair Moss: The staff that you hire, are they local kids mostly? 16
Mr. Stetson: Yes, high school students as well as college students. If the college 17
students are out of state for the school year, they come back in the summertime to work 18
for our camps. 19
Vice Chair Moss: As far as the participants for the Teen Week Out and the CIT program, 20
56 and 45, how are those numbers compared to the past? 21
Mr. Stetson: We were very happy with those as well, especially for our CIT program. 22
One of the challenges we faced was the youth and teen clerical assistant overseeing the 23
applications for CIT had left us at the end of the spring season. That's when we're 24
receiving a large majority of our applications for the program. As we transitioned to 25 having someone else take on the CIT program and trying to identify what applications we 26 had received versus any that were missing, there were some we came across and luckily 27 we were able to reach out to all interested participants. With 45 participants, I believe 28
this was one of our higher summers for the CIT program. We were very happy with that. 29
For the Teen Week Out camp, with 56 we were happy with that as well. 30
Mr. Howard: That's pretty much capacity because we are driving those participants in 31
our vans. It's actually a smaller number than we'd like. We'd like to find a way to 32
transport more students, but we are at capacity in that camp. 33
Vice Chair Moss: That's great. Great to know. Thank you. 34
Approved Minutes 38
APPROVED
Commissioner Cribbs: This is great. Thank you very much. I have a couple of 1
questions. I'd love it if you could provide—not tonight—the number of teens in Palo 2
Alto and the number of middle schoolers in Palo Alto just to get a sense of how many 3
people we're serving and maybe what the percentages are. That would be really 4
interesting. 5
Mr. Howard: Just to clarify, you said how many teens are in Palo Alto living or going to 6 school? 7
Commissioner Cribbs: Yeah, are in Palo Alto, living and going to school here. Just an 8
observation. This is not an easy job dealing with teens and trying to figure out what it is 9
you all want to do next and that kind of thing. My hat is off to you and the staff because 10
it's really challenging. Of all the recreation kinds of jobs, it's probably the toughest. 11
Could you explain the difference between the Palo Alto Youth Council and the Teen 12
Advisory Board. 13
Mr. Stetson: I'll let Adam speak on PAYC. For the Teen Advisory Board, this is really a 14
group of very gifted high school students that come together to put on special events for 15
other teens in the community. Some of the types of events that they've put on the past 16
include movie nights, trivia nights, cupcake wars. We just had our first event for the year 17
on November 17th, which I was very excited about. It was a bath bombs and Boba event, 18
where they got to make their own bath bombs, and we also brewed our own Boba tea. 19
We weren't sure in terms of how many people we could expect for the event, but we had 20
about 50 people in attendance, which we were very excited about. For it to be our first 21
event of the year, we couldn't start it off any better way. We're definitely hoping to 22
continue with that momentum and build on it as we get into the new year and expand 23
more offerings for the spring and winter seasons. 24
Chair Reckdahl: That event was at Mitchell Park or where? 25
Mr. Stetson: At the Mitchell Park Teen Center. I'll turn it over to Adam about PAYC. 26
Mr. Howard: The Palo Alto Youth Council, again a group of high school students that 27 look at either policy issues or issues that directly affect what they feel high schools 28
students. They'll look at things like transportation issues in and around school, have 29
youth forums where they can discuss issues about either school or finals or having a teen 30
dance. I'm just throwing things out. Really, the reason we have two groups is we just 31
were trying to fulfill a need. The Youth Council was getting 20-plus applications every 32
year. We couldn't handle them. We created another group, had one go more toward high 33
schools activities and one go towards high school policies. We're attracting two different 34
types or kinds of kids, so we get a little bit different crowd at each event. It just allows a 35
little bit more students to be involved. 36
Approved Minutes 39
APPROVED
Commissioner Cribbs: That's great. Could you talk a little bit about the diversity on the 1
Youth Council and where the kids come from and then the gender balance? 2
Mr. Howard: Gender, it's pretty close to 50/50, and it typically is. That just happens 3
naturally. We're not looking to do that in any way. We would encourage it, but it just 4
happens pretty naturally. We're heavily between Gunn and Paly, but we do have four or 5
five Castilleja students this year between the two groups, which is better than it has been 6 in years past. We range freshmen through seniors, more sophomores and juniors than the 7
lower and upper classmen, that's just a natural progression. As they go up, some of them 8
stay and are passionate, and some of them go onto other things. 9
Commissioner Cribbs: How does one apply for a Think grant or project or submit a 10
project to be considered? How does that happen? What the process? 11
Mr. Howard: There's a proposal that you would fill out. Those proposals do ask for 12
budget requests, who your program would be impacting and a guess of how many high 13
school students you would be impacting directly, who's involved, what help you might 14
need from City staff. This year, we're trying to up this a little bit to get more kids 15
involved, so we're going to hold three public meetings for high school students in three 16
different locations around the City to give them more information. We do our best to get 17
on the high school campuses; that's not always the easiest thing to do. We try to get to 18
their lunchtime activities. We try to do it through word of mouth. Once a kid or a group 19
of kids provides us with an application, there's a Teen Services Committee that oversees 20
it, asks questions. If there's anything we don't fully understand from their proposals, we 21
get feedback from them, and then we typically approve unless we feel like it's not going 22
to be something that helps enough Palo Alto high school students. 23
Commissioner Cribbs: That's great. I don't have any more questions right now. Thank 24
you very much. 25
Commissioner McCauley: Let me echo everyone else in applauding you. This is a 26 helpful overview. You've also picked up that this is a metric-hungry group probably both 27 from the prior presentation and this one. Any additional metrics you have to provide us, 28
I'm sure we would love to receive them and have a better understanding, deeper 29
understanding at some level of what's going on. A moment of levity. What is a bath 30
bomb? 31
Mr. Stetson: Sorry about that. Bath bomb, if you're taking a bath—they sell them at 32
places like Lush, a store at Stanford Shopping Center. You drop it into the bathwater and 33
it expands with different aromas to basically make your bath time more enjoyable. 34
Commissioner McCauley: Good to know. You alluded to building out transportation 35
options for middle schoolers. What are you plans in that regard? 36
Approved Minutes 40
APPROVED
Mr. Stetson: Really looking to utilize some of the bike paths. I know they installed a 1
new one along Ross Road, but also looking at some of the bus transportation options. 2
What's challenging with Terman being further from our Teen Center is identifying what 3
is the safest route for them to get there, so that parents feel they can let their teens travel 4
after school to get there. Also, for Jordan Middle School, they're not as far away as 5
Terman, but identifying they have to cross that busy intersection of Oregon Expressway 6 and trying to identify if there are safer routes to get to the Teen Center or, if we were 7
looking at bus services, to see if we can provide specific hours for middle schools 8
students but also identifying timewise when they get out of school and where the pickup 9
location would be and how soon we can get them over to our Teen Center. It's looking at 10
those bus schedules and bike routes. 11
Commissioner McCauley: Is there anything that this Commission could do in order to 12
help bring attention to the issue of diversifying the middle school program, the LEAP 13
program, by allowing more middle schoolers from Terman and from Jordan Middle 14
Schools to participate? Is this a budget issue? Is this something else that we could be 15
helpful about? 16
Mr. Stetson: For us, I would just say it's taking the time to do more thorough research for 17
it. Again, because we are newer with our staff for the Teen Center, specifically our Teen 18
Center Director, we're still trying to get situated and make sure we're still providing the 19
programs that they've come to expect of the years. As we settle into our positions, it's 20
going to take more time for us to do that research and figure it out. 21
Commissioner McCauley: On the summer camps and the wait lists, are we talking about 22
dozens of kids on wait lists or is this a relatively small population and so we don't feel as 23
though we're not meeting the demands. We're largely meeting the demand, and there's a 24
handful of people who aren't able to participate. 25
Mr. Howard: For recreation camps specifically, we meet most demand. We have 10 or 26 12 kids throughout that are on a wait list with 55 on it. We are meeting most of the 27 demand. We feel like if we put in the right research and the time, we could get them all 28
off, again maybe not Plan A but we want to make sure everyone has an option to go to a 29
summer camp. 30
Commissioner McCauley: That's all that I have. Thank you again. 31
Chair Reckdahl: The Think or the Bryant Street Garage has mentors. Does the City 32
provide those or do the students have to find them? How do we match make that? 33
Mr. Howard: The main mentor is Jose Perez, who's City of Palo Alto staff. He works at 34
Mitchell Park. As a team at Mitchell Park, we all mentor as needed. 35
Approved Minutes 41
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: How many kids do the Think? Was it 25? How many proposals did 1
you have last year? 2
Mr. Stetson: In terms of how many funded programs? 3
Chair Reckdahl: Yeah. 4
Mr. Stetson: For Think Fund, we did fund up to—there's 20 teen-inspired programs that 5
were funded; that totaled $23,000. In terms of how many teens were served, 6 approximately 1,600. 7
Commissioner Cribbs: Is that a budgeted item in the City budget, where that money 8
comes from, or does it come from a donor? 9
Mr. Howard: It comes from the Bryant Street Garage Fund. I don't even know all the 10
history. When it was transferred to a garage, money was funneled in specifically for 11
Teen Services. 12
Chair Reckdahl: Twenty teen projects, how did we get to 1,600 teens from 20 projects? 13
Mr. Stetson: That was for the various projects that were put on including the 14
documentaries, Project Anybody, the Students United Against Cancer. Through these 15
various projects, there is teen participation amongst them. If you total up all the teen 16
participation between those 20 funded projects … 17
Chair Reckdahl: They aren't necessarily running the show, but they're doing little bits 18
and parts. How many kids are on each of these projects typically? If we have a proposal, 19
is it one person that does it or is it a group of four or five? 20
Mr. Stetson: It can vary, but it's usually a group effort. In terms of how many people, it 21
can vary per project. If it's a more complex project, they they're probably going to have a 22
bigger group, as you said, four or five people who are working on it. 23
Chair Reckdahl: I noticed there's one guy in the picture at the bottom right. Is that a fan? 24
He's the fan man? 25
Mr. Howard: That's a student in the Make X program. He built a paraglider. He really 26 go up with a parachute on a homemade-built fan. Nothing I've encouraged; I promise 27 you that. You'll also see him around town riding an electric scooter that he built himself. 28
Chair Reckdahl: Are most of them like a documentary-type artsy thing or are they more 29
techie? What kind of distribution do we have? 30
Approved Minutes 42
APPROVED
Mr. Howard: It's a wide range. Some of them ask for funding for an intramural dodge 1
ball game to build relationships between students and teachers. Dodge ball to movie 2
making to bath projects, it's really anywhere a teen's imagination can take them. 3
Commissioner Cribbs: Is there a project list or a list someplace that you post that we've 4
missed? 5
Mr. Howard: We keep it on the Think Fund page. We can pass that information along. 6
Commissioner Cribbs: Thank you. That's great. 7
Chair Reckdahl: The Teen Center, how full is the Teen Center when it's usually open? Is 8
it sparse or is it heavy? 9
Mr. Stetson: In terms of numbers, technically the Teen Center can hold at capacity 114 10
people. For our participation numbers, 35-45 on a daily basis is pretty good for us. In 11
previous years, we were lucky if we had 20 or so. Again, we're trying to identify options 12
to bring more teens into the Teen Center. Starting with 35-45 and continuing to grow 13
with the program, we can see the numbers continuing to grow. One concern we had was 14
with the recent Daylight Savings Time ending, as it gets dark earlier, if that would affect 15
the program and if participation would dwindle. We were happy to see consistency with 16
those numbers. 17
Chair Reckdahl: I thought we used to have high school events there. On Friday or 18
Saturday night, we'd have some high school hang-out time. 19
Mr. Howard: Before Tyler and I, there was Friday open hours for high school students. 20
It just wasn't well attended. What we heard from them was if they're going to do 21
something, they want it to be organized, not just an open space. That's why we hold our 22
events at Mitchell Park. The TAB events are there. A lot of the other youth groups, 23
when they hold events, poetry slams, books, a lot of those things all get held at the Teen 24
Center on Friday nights typically. 25
Chair Reckdahl: How do we recruit for the two councils that we were talking about 26 earlier? The Palo Alto Youth Council and the Teen Advisory Board, how do we recruit 27 for that in the high schools? 28
Mr. Howard: We can go to their—it's not job fair. They have lunchtime opportunities 29
for organizations to come and table—it's their club day. That's what it is. When they get 30
to distribute their clubs, we've been able to go to those club days. Part of the role of a 31
student that's on one of those advisory boards is to hand out applications to their peers 32
when the time comes. 33
Approved Minutes 43
APPROVED
Chair Reckdahl: I asked my son—my son's a junior at Gunn. I asked him about these, 1
and he said, "I don't know what they do." He was very ignorant about that, and he's an 2
active kid. He does a lot of other things on campus. I'm not sure how to inform the 3
people that this things exists and what it does. 4
Mr. Howard: It's something we're always working on, just how wide of a net we can 5
cast. To be honest, there are a lot of options, clubs, teams, leadership groups. There are 6 going to be times when students don't know about all of them. We really do our best to 7
get out to those clubs and send things out in flyers and get it on all the social media. To 8
say that we're reaching everyone, I know is not true. That's for sure. 9
Chair Reckdahl: It's hard because they're so fragmented. It was easier 40 years ago when 10
you just had one way of communicating and that was through the teachers or through the 11
big events. Any follow-up questions. Go ahead. 12
Commissioner McDougall: If I an just go backwards through some of these. At the 13
beginning, I said we'd be—Ryan said the same thing. We'd like to know what kind of 14
things we might help with. It seems like the biggest challenge is the communications. 15
I'm not sure how we help with that. Awareness that communications to the community 16
from all of these different groups or about all of these different groups is number one. I 17
would say that part of that—Adam, I thought it was really interesting that you said, "If 18
you said 'all the teens come, we've got this neat space,'" you didn't get anybody. If you 19
said, "Here's an activity … ." My sense was from the opening of that and we had the 20
same problem in the Library when you say teens the first thing that happens is the 10-21
year-olds and 12-year-olds, maybe the 13-year-olds say this is our opportunity, we're 22
teens. As soon as those teens show up, the 15-18-year-old high school students don't 23
show up. They know when you say open time, you get the younger people. That's why 24
the older people don't go. If you say it's a sophisticated activity, then you've got control 25 over it. Does that make sense, Adam? 26
Mr. Howard: Definitely. We use the word teens here, but we're very specific when we 27 advertise for high school students or middle school students. 28
Commissioner McDougall: We as an audience—back to Ryan's comment about we like 29
granular answers and numbers, it would be useful to us to see it divided that way. I'm 30
surprised you don't have more volunteers or demand more volunteers. You could get 31
volunteers to help with some of these programs. I don't think you need to answer that. I 32
would encourage that. Another time I'd like to see more conversation relative to the 41 33
development steps or items. I don't think you can address all 41 in every one of these 34
programs. In the Library, we said there's 41, and we're going to do Numbers 13, 12, and 35
24 or whatever it was and focus on that. Another question I have is you keep mentioning 36
Castilleja. Do Castilleja students—I'm not sure I care what the answer is—get everything 37
Approved Minutes 44
APPROVED
free the same way a Paly or Gunn student would? Does Castilleja contribute financially 1
to some of these programs? 2
Mr. Stetson: Because the programs that are put on are through the City, if the 3
participants are coming from Paly, Gunn, or Castilleja, it's not something they would 4
have to contribute. It's set in our expenditure budget for the teen leadership groups. 5
Commissioner McDougall: We know that 60 percent, 70 percent of Castilleja students 6 are not from Palo Alto and many of them are not even from California. I'm not sure I 7
care that we pay or don't pay. The other thing—just two last question. $280,000, 700 8
participants, what price do we charge for these camps? Do we charge $100 or $50? 9
Mr. Stetson: It depends on the camp, but it is generally more. Our Teen Week Out 10
camps, because we're taking them places such as theme parks like Great America, Raging 11
Waters, and because we're obviously traveling to different sites, those camps can run 12
anywhere from $400 to $600 per week. 13
Commissioner McDougall: I assumed that the answer was it depends. If you've got 14
$280,000 from 700 participations, that's an average of about $40. That would imply that 15
there are several not paying for these. That's okay if we have some sort of program that 16
says you don't have to pay, you can be on a scholarship under certain circumstances. Is 17
that correct? 18
Mr. Howard: Yes, the City does offer a fee reduction program, which can be up to 50 19
percent of the cost of a program. 20
Commissioner McDougall: In another round of this, I'd be really interested in knowing 21
what percentage are under some sort of scholarship and some general idea of was that 22
needs based or what. $280,000 sounds like a lot of money, but with 700 participants it 23
doesn't sound like a lot of money. My last thing would be—I'm sorry. Then it is a lot of 24
money. You have the Teen Advisory Board, and one of them is the Teen Library 25 Advisory Council. I doubt it makes sense to have a Teen Parks and Rec Advisory 26 Council, but it probably does make sense for us to identify as a council some of the items 27 that come before us and refer them to one of your councils so that we get teen 28
participation. Relative to the leadership and the City leadership and some of the 29
directions these kids are going, that could be a god opportunity both for us to get good 30
input and for them to participate in some of the kinds of items that affect them and the 31
City. 32
Mr. Howard: I totally agree with you. That's something I probably would have wanted 33
to talk about tonight. The Palo Alto Youth Council has a liaison from the City Council to 34
the Palo Alto Youth Council, so they come quarterly to a meeting, meet the kids, hear 35
what's going on. There's some communication. At the end of the year, the Youth 36
Approved Minutes 45
APPROVED
Council puts a presentation to the City Council on basically their achievements for the 1
year. What I could see is you guys having that relationship with the Teen Advisory 2
Board who's more activity-based. I think it'd be useful for the students especially. With 3
enough leadership, it could be useful to you as well. 4
Chair Reckdahl: One route that I would see is once a year they put together their list of 5
what the Parks and Rec not do for them, what improvements. It doesn't have to be long. 6 They could sit there for 10 minutes and say we'd like these types of programs or we'd like 7
the parks to have this type of facility. That would be very useful for us. 8
Commissioner McDougall: I think we could be even more active than that in terms of 9
almost everything we look at. The dog park came before us. Should they be involved in 10
the—should we ask them to offer their opinion on the dog park. It wouldn't take much 11
for us to remember each item that comes before us to say should we ask the teens as 12
opposed to just come before us once a year with a list. I think it would be good for us to 13
contribute to that activity. It could improve both of us. 14
Chair Reckdahl: One of the concerns that Council has too many adults going to this was 15
going to make it uncool. They wanted to keep an arm's length away. 16
Commissioner McDougall: I don't think we need to go to the meeting. We could just 17
submit a topic. We don't have to be there. Would you like to comment on this? They 18
can say no, we don't give a darn, or they could say yeah, we'd like to present on that. I'm 19
not suggesting we show up at the meeting. Just provide them opportunities to participate 20
in City government. 21
Vice Chair Moss: I have one more comment. The only concern I have about the Teen 22
Center in Mitchell Park is what percentage of Paly of students and what percentage of 23
Jordan students get to use the Teen Center in Mitchell Park. I suspect it's not 50/50. I'm 24
really excited when you talk about the teen programs reaching out to people in the 25 schools and doing activities at the schools so that they don't have to come to the Teen 26 Center for all the programs and all of the opportunities that you have. This Commission 27 is supposed to be watching out for all the kids in all the neighborhoods. That would be 28
my only concern. Anything you can do to push your programs out from that Mitchell 29
Park Center to all those other campuses would be great. Even having one out of three 30
meetings at Paly or one out of three meetings at Gunn or at Terman, I don't know. That's 31
all I wanted to mention. 32
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you very much. Do we know when you'll come back again? It's 33
once year you're going to come back or is this just free form? 34
Ms. O'Kane: I asked them to come tonight because there was a request one of the 35
Commissioners to come and present and because we had new Commissioners. I think it 36
Approved Minutes 46
APPROVED
had been a year or so since we last heard this presentation. It could be an annual 1
summary or it could be twice a year. Something that might be helpful, piggybacking on 2
what Commissioner McDougall said—in San Jose, the San Jose Parks and Rec 3
Commission has a teen come and report at every meeting on what they've been up to, 4
what they've been working on. That might be something think about doing here. Maybe 5
it's not every meeting, maybe it's every quarter that someone from one of the leadership 6 groups can come and talk to the Commission about what they're doing. You could even 7
have some dialog with them. I did want to follow up on more thing about that. We do 8
try and offer some youth and teen programs that aren't about academics and aren't about 9
another leadership opportunity; something else to put on their college application but 10
things that allow them to be outside of that atmosphere. Like Tyler was mentioning, the 11
TAB group does these special events for teens that are really a place for them to be with 12
their peers and do something fun and have it be a little bit structured but it's planned by 13
their peers for them. We try to have a broad range of things they can do. If they're really 14
into the leadership programs, that's great. If they want to do things that are more 15
recreational and fun, that's great too. We're trying to balance that. 16
Vice Chair Moss: About the timing. If they wanted to present something to us toward 17
the end of the school year about what they accomplished or things like that and if they 18
wanted to come back around now or October and say the things they want to do over the 19
year, they'd have a reason to come. That timing would be great. 20
Ms. O'Kane: That makes sense. That's a good idea. 21
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you. 22
Mr. Stetson: Thank you. 23
6. Other Ad Hoc Committee and Liaison Updates. 24
Chair Reckdahl: The next piece of business is ad hoc updates. Does anyone from ad 25 hocs—David. 26
Vice Chair Moss: I'm sorry that … Daren gave us a tour of the Renzel Marsh and the 27 ITT property that was pretty well received. There were five or six people who are 28
interested stakeholders in the Baylands. That was useful for everybody. It really does 29
show how much of an interest there is in the ITT property. Originally, it was going to be 30
a footnote in the Baylands Comprehensive Plan. With all the interest in the Renzel 31
Marsh and the ITT property, it's going to be more than that because there was a lot of 32
interest. One of the big things was do we need and want that building that's out there. 33
That raised a lot of issues because it's in such poor shape. It encourages cars and parking 34
lots and things like that to get out there. Unfortunately, they put this building in the 35
middle of the marsh. It certainly would be nice to move it near 101. Those kinds of 36
Approved Minutes 47
APPROVED
issues about what to do with that building or even whether we need a building. The 1
second big issue was you want a pristine center where animals and birds can be. If you 2
put a whole lot of trails all the way through it, there's no contiguous area. That was 3
another big issue that came up. All these thing we're going to talk about in the Baylands 4
Comprehensive Plan. I just wanted to give you a heads up. the second whole area that 5
happened this past month is a whole bunch of activity with the Fry's property. I think 6 there's now a plan or something, a big development at the Fry's property. That has 7
implications for the discussion we had earlier about the ATT property and expanding 8
Boulware Park and the timing of the updates to Boulware Park and whether or not we're 9
going to get another park, something like that. I would sure like to hear more about that 10
as an item in the next month or two or three. I think it's ripe for discussion. 11
Ms. O'Kane: I can look into that and see what sort of update we can provide. 12
Chair Reckdahl: I haven't heard anything new. The last I heard, they hadn't even 13
subdivided the property yet. 14
Commissioner McDougall: Nothing has happened. 15
Chair Reckdahl: Any other? 16
Commissioner McCauley: Something that I found very handy and helpful was the short 17
submissions that Tanya would solicit from the group. It might have been on my 18
suggestion that she started soliciting our short positions on each ad hoc committee. Are 19
others interested in restarting that? Is it helpful or is it more of a chore? 20
Chair Reckdahl: I found it helpful. 21
Commissioner Cribbs: I thought it was very helpful. 22
Chair Reckdahl: We always can say no update. 23
Commissioner McCauley: Over the summer we started the practice of essentially 24
sending email updates a week or 2 weeks in advance of these monthly meetings about 25 what the ad hocs have been up to in the past month. In the transition with Tanya leaving, 26 we may not have done it this past month. It's not a big deal by any means. I definitely 27 would like to pick up the practice again if others are in favor of it. 28
Commissioner McDougall: I totally agree. Any advance opportunity to come prepared is 29
useful. 30
Commissioner McCauley: Dog parks, everybody's up to speed on where that's at. The 31
other two ad hocs that I'm on are the Baylands 10-acre ad hoc committee. Just so the rest 32
of the Commission is aware, that's essentially on hold while the Joint Powers Authority 33
Approved Minutes 48
APPROVED
continues to do work on other areas of the Baylands. It looks as though based on what 1
Daren's feedback—Jeff and Keith, please jump in here if I misspeak. Essentially, that 2
will not be an issue that's ripe until probably next summer and maybe even later than that. 3
Chair Reckdahl: I wish Daren was still here. When we had that tour, he was saying 4
maybe fall there would be something to talk about. In the last email, he bumped that out. 5
I'd like to talk to him. It may be good just to get together even if it's only for a half hour 6 just to touch base and talk about issues and organize our thoughts. That might be useful. 7
Commissioner McCauley: Absolutely. The 7.7 acres in Foothills—Jeff and Don, please 8
jump in here too. That will be on our agenda next month, it looks like. Daren is trying to 9
get a meeting with the City Manager's staff. I think that will happen this week; that's the 10
latest. Hopefully we'll have additional news next month on … 11
Ms. O'Kane: That meeting's happening tomorrow. 12
Commissioner McDougall: My thought was the 7.7 acres and what to do with it and that 13
challenge should be given to the Teen Council. The other thing we should get is an 14
update on what was happening with the Golf Course. It was supposed to be opening in 15
November. We should get an update on that. In terms of ad hoc information, I just got a 16
notice about the San Francisco Bay resilience assessment. It's just a 1-hour webinar 17
tomorrow. Kristen, I want to give this to you. It looks like something—if we don't 18
already know about, maybe somebody could listen to a webinar for an hour. The other 19
thing that's happening tomorrow is another Project Safety Net meeting. They continue to 20
provide the kind of youth support that needs to continue to be integrated with what we 21
heard in terms of the teen activity here. I'm the representative. I will probably try and go 22
to this meeting. Everybody else should be aware of it as well. 23
Commissioner Greenfield: Most of the updates for the ad hocs that I'm sitting on and the 24
liaison role are really on hold waiting for staff resources, which leads me to my question 25 in terms of staffing. Do we have a timeline or any progress regarding a new Community 26 Services Director? Is there an intention to backfill Tanya's position? 27
Ms. O'Kane: Related to your first question, the recruitment for the Community Services 28
Director is underway. When that decision is made or when that process is final, I can't 29
speak to that. For Tanya's position, recruitment either opened or recently closed. 30
Catherine Bourquin: We'll be having interviews next week. 31
Commissioner Greenfield: That's great. I recognize that the Commission has been very 32
ambitious or enthusiastic in terms of the number of ad hocs that we wanted and that does 33
weigh on the staff resources. To an extent, we knew this was going to be happening. We 34
couldn't predict the number of openings that would further exacerbate the issue. We 35
Approved Minutes 49
APPROVED
appreciate the time and effort that staff does put in the quality of the effort when our 1
number comes up. Thank you. 2
Commissioner McCauley: May I ask real quickly? I'm going to bring up one of my 3
favorite topics, which is field use and pickleball. It looks as though field use and 4
pickleball is on the agenda for next month. What about the temporary lighting issue at 5
Cubberley field, which seemed to be a time-sensitive issue? Where does that one stand? 6
Chair Reckdahl: Can you talk to that, Adam? Our recommendation was they work with 7
staff or the field use ad hoc. 8
Mr. Howard: We've been working with Planning. We want to make sure we know what 9
final steps need to—who can give the final approval for this and what permits will be 10
needed even for a 1-month trial period. I have a meeting with someone from Planning 11
Thursday, so we should know the final steps by then. We're going to ask the youth 12
soccer groups to come back, fill us in more with their plans. Some of the questions we've 13
had for them were who would be using it, make sure the technology is going to be useful, 14
they actually have a lighting plan from a lighting company. When they came to us with 15
this, it was very much a "we think this could work." We need to know it will work 16
before we push too far ahead. The youth soccer groups are working on getting a more 17
detailed lighting plan on that aspect as well. As for pickleball, we have a company doing 18
some general sketches of the Mitchell Park area so that we have a visual idea that we can 19
show people. I will be meeting with a pickleball ad hoc group and a tennis ad hoc group 20
as soon as I have those drawings in hand, which I will invite the ad hoc to. 21
Chair Reckdahl: I assume that the soccer people are renting these lights. 22
Mr. Howard: That is their plan, yes. 23
Chair Reckdahl: I assume that the rental company can give them an evening and show 24
them what it looks like, and we can do a dry run. 25
Mr. Howard: They could just bring the lights out, yes, but the ad hoc was more interested 26 in an actual lighting plan so we could see light pollution, height of the lights, the noise 27 level. We wanted more than to just bring out these lights and turn them on. We wanted a 28
more concrete plan. 29
Commissioner McDougall: We need to make sure we know what the security system is 30
to keep the lights under control. 31
Mr. Howard: From disappearing in the middle of the night. 32
Commissioner McDougall: And keep them on or off at the right time. 33
Approved Minutes 50
APPROVED
Commissioner Cribbs: Having said that, we were also concerned that whatever we 1
decided would work for Cubberley could be transferred, if it needed to be, in the future to 2
try to find more field space. Adam was really good about trying to think about all the 3
potential problems or issues—not problems, but challenges that would come up and 4
really cognizant of the fact that the soccer groups are interested in having a decision soon. 5
We're all aware of the time pressure. 6
Chair Reckdahl: We're still shooting to get this down—February is when they wanted it. 7
Mr. Howard: February is the 1-month trial they'd like to run. We think we can still do 8
that hopefully. 9
Chair Reckdahl: Thank you. David. 10
Vice Chair Moss: I just want to make you aware that you should get the Greenmeadow 11
Association involved as soon as possible because they will have strong feelings about it. 12
Two things that I wanted to make you covered is make sure the number of drop-offs on 13
Nelson at a very dark time of the year that the safety of the kids is taken into 14
consideration. It can be a real zoo there. I hope most of the people will park over in the 15
parking lot, not on Nelson. The second thing is the lights, if you put them close to 16
Nelson facing east so that you light the fields from the east, you'll get very little solar 17
because the trees are in the way. That means you've got to put them either in the center 18
or on the far end, on the Cubberley end. You won't be able to cover the entire field. 19
You're going to have to limit how much of the field they can light. Of course, if you put 20
the lights on the Cubberley side facing Nelson, you're going to get light pollution unless 21
you can focus them down on the field. All those things I hope you're taking into 22
consideration. 23
Chair Reckdahl: This is where the lighting plan would (crosstalk). 24
Mr. Howard: Which is why we really wanted to do that. We don't want to go without 25 having a real concrete plan. We completely understand the neighbors and how close they 26 are in proximity to the situation. Really we're going to put a lot of the onus back on the 27 user groups to go out and win over the neighbors. We understand how big of an impact 28
this will be. 29
Ms. O'Kane: Can I suggest that we agendize this for a future meeting? We're getting 30
into a big of a discussion on this topic. We can come back in December with an 31
agendized item. 32
Chair Reckdahl: In December, Adam will have more information hopefully. Let's move 33
on. 34
Approved Minutes 51
APPROVED
VI. COMMENTS AND ANNOUNCEMENTS 1
Chair Reckdahl: The next is Comments and Announcements. 2
Ms. O'Kane: Can I interject and go back to something Commissioner McCauley asked 3
about the 10 1/2 acres? Our current fiscal year capital adopted budget does not have any 4
funding for the 10 10/2 acres. It's in the fiscal year '19 projected budget. That would 5
need to be finalized in our next budget cycle. It's forecast for fiscal year '19, but that 6 would still need to be adopted by City Council in fiscal year '19. That's just for outreach 7
and a conceptual design of the 10 1/2 acres. 8
Commissioner McCauley: The outreach would happen sometime in July 2018 or later. 9
That's why I said things are more or less on hold on the Baylands 10 acres until then. 10
Chair Reckdahl: Comments and Announcements. Do you have anything? 11
Commissioner McCauley: Forgive me. I know the hour's getting a little bit late. 12
Something that Anne and I were discussing before the meeting is the amount of paper we 13
produce and consume. This month's packet was actually pretty thin compared to many of 14
the packets. I wonder if there isn't a way for us to consume less paper. Right now, we 15
essentially have copies provided to us here. I understand the public also needs copies. I 16
wonder whether there isn't some way to at least save on the copies you provide to us if 17
we're all able to bring copies that we receive. Alternatively, if we just receive things 18
electronically in the first instance, that might reduce some of the burden on your staff 19
anyway to deliver all these packets. 20
Ms. O'Kane: I really appreciate that comment. I would say if anyone does not want a 21
paper copy delivered or mailed to them, you can certainly let Catherine know, and we 22
will not do that. I know there are some people who like the paper, especially when it is a 23
large document because it's easier to read for some people. If you'd like the electronic 24
version, just let Catherine know. If there's a way we can communicate that this is a big 25 Master Plan report, do you want a hard copy versus electronic, we could do that too. 26 We're definitely open to suggestions. We don't want to overburden anyone with paper. 27 We want to conserve as much as possible. 28
Commissioner Cribbs: What we were trying to decide is if we could challenge ourselves 29
for a couple of months and say we're not going to have any paper delivered to us this 30
month. We're going to see how it works, and we'll have the agenda at our places and see 31
what happens. We might not be able to do it, but it would be fun to try it. 32
Chair Reckdahl: Trying it for a couple of months is a great idea. If we don't like it, we 33
can just say we failed. I suspect that we'll get used to it. At least half the time, I'm 34
looking on the screen anyway. 35
Approved Minutes 52
APPROVED
Vice Chair Moss: Some things are useful and some things are not. The things that are 1
useful are the tables of data that have been talked about. It's good to be able to write on 2
those. To have the presentation with the beautiful color pictures, I don't necessarily need 3
that. If we could be more selective, that would be great. The agendas and things like 4
that, just seeing them on the screen is probably okay. 5
Chair Reckdahl: Should we try next month not having paper copies? 6
Commissioner Greenfield: It depends on what's on the agenda. If we're talking about 7
double page foldouts, that's something I want a hard copy to be able to see it properly. 8
There may be a happy medium where staff can be selective about which items are sent to 9
us and which items aren't. Certainly, providing us a copy of the presentation in our 10
packet and here would be the low-hanging fruit of this discussion. 11
Ms. O'Kane: How about Catherine and I discuss how we can make this work as far as 12
notifying you that you might want this in hard copy. 13
VII. TENTATIVE AGENDA FOR DECEMBER 19, 2017 MEETING 14
Chair Reckdahl: Agenda for next month. We have Rinconada PIO. What does that 15
mean, "tentative"? That means we're not sure whether he's going to have it ready? 16
Ms. O'Kane: I think that's a carryover. I don't think that needs to come to the 17
Commission because this item is going to Council on December 5. I think that's a 18
carryover. It won't be coming back to the Commission. There definitely will be an 19
update on the Baylands Boardwalk, specifically related to CEQA as well as a response to 20
some of the comments that were received from the Commission about the handrails that 21
spin and things like that. Public Works will be coming back to give an update on that. 22
I'll confirm with Daren on the 7.7 acres and the Buckeye Creek hydrology study based on 23
our meeting with the City Manager's Office tomorrow on whether that's an update or 24
action. Possibly the dog park PIO for Peers Park—dog park rules. Pickleball, Adam, can 25 we come back next month with pickleball? 26
Chair Reckdahl: Also Cubberley lights. 27
Ms. O'Kane: That sounds like a pretty full agenda. 28
Chair Reckdahl: One thing that fell off our list here was restrictions on dedicated 29
parkland. The attorney was going to come in and give us a tutorial. Sometime in 2018. 30
Commissioner Cribbs: What's the situation for Master Plan funding, that we had that 31
great report on? Where is that? 32
Chair Reckdahl: When is that going to Council? 33
Approved Minutes 53
APPROVED
Ms. O'Kane: We have been looking at that table a little bit more that we presented. 1
Before we go to Council, we're going to meet with our City Manager and Chief Financial 2
Officer as well as the City Attorney just to ensure what we're presenting to Council is—3
everyone's on the same page and we're saying appropriate things. That meeting is 4
happening in the next 2 weeks with the City Manager's Office. We'll determine at that 5
point what the next step is, whether it's coming back here or going to Council. 6
Chair Reckdahl: My preference would be go to Council as soon as you can. If it's 7
incomplete, it's incomplete. Just give them an update of saying this is what we're looking 8
at and ask for guidance. We still haven't gotten crisp guidance from the whole Council. 9
Certain Council people have said their opinions, but they haven't had a full discussion on 10
this. 11
Ms. O'Kane: We want to make sure we do have all of the appropriate facts. Some of the 12
Commissioners here say present the data and the information we have. If we're including 13
information on a potential new tax measure for the community, we want to make sure 14
we're presenting the correct data on that, which would be a ballot measure. We're going 15
to present all the options, but we need to make sure what we're presenting is correct. 16
Chair Reckdahl: The other option is some of the Council Members may say we don't 17
want you to go down this road. If you get that direction, you've saved yourself a lot of 18
work by going back early. That's why getting the whole Council to discus it and give you 19
direction might ensure you don't waste your time. 20
Vice Chair Moss: Did anything come out of the 101 bridge discussion yesterday that we 21
need to have an update on or anything like that? Was it pretty much a rubber stamp? 22
Chair Reckdahl: Did you got to last night's meeting? 23
Ms. O'Kane: It was approved by Council. 24
Commissioner McDougall: It was approved by Council. The two big issues were 25 signage. Once the signage got brought up by one, it got piled on. My admonition to 26 anybody who's going before Council is that's the kind of thing you have to anticipate. It 27 was a big deal. The second issue was it used to be $6 million, then it was $10 million, 28
and now it's $16 million. The $16 million includes $2.4 million of salary that wasn't in 29
there previously, so we're comparing prunes to apricots. The issue was we've gone from 30
$10 million to $16 million. Google's still at $1 million. Why isn't Google at $1.6 31
million? Why shouldn't Intuit and all these others contribute as well? My argument to 32
that—I'm sorry you asked, so I'm going to tell you—was I asked the group what's the use 33
case and is the use case totally commercial or totally weekend travelers. If that had been 34
anticipated, then the question to who should pay for it might have been better answered. 35
Ryan's laughing at me because I keep asking about signs. I'm going to keep asking as we 36
Approved Minutes 54
APPROVED
go forward with various things what is the use case, have we thought about what the 1
purpose of this is. That causes us to think about it. It was approved in the end, but there 2
was several amendments to what was recommended. The amendments were all in the 3
direction of signage and paying for it and so on. 4
Chair Reckdahl: Google's not doing this out of the goodness of their heart. This $1 5
million will be credited to future mitigation (crosstalk). 6
Commissioner McDougall: That needed to be understood in the conversation. There 7
were some Council Members who thought they were doing it out of the goodness of their 8
heart and why shouldn't they have a bigger heart. That wasn't the purpose. 9
VIII. ADJOURNMENT 10
Meeting adjourned on motion by Commissioner Cribbs and second by Commissioner 11
McDougall at 10:04 p.m. 12
Approved Minutes 55